WEBVTT 00:00:11.309 --> 00:00:15.809 Hello, friends, and welcome back to your weekly Linux talk show. My name is Chris. 00:00:15.969 --> 00:00:16.589 My name is Wes. 00:00:16.889 --> 00:00:17.909 And my name is Brent. 00:00:18.269 --> 00:00:24.489 Hello, gentlemen. Well, coming up on the show today, it does seem to be the storage apocalypse. 00:00:25.029 --> 00:00:28.549 It's here. It's real. And an old friend's going to drop by to talk survival 00:00:28.549 --> 00:00:30.009 strategies as prices explode. 00:00:30.169 --> 00:00:35.509 And then we've got an unapologetically 90s approach to stretching your current storage. 00:00:35.709 --> 00:00:39.509 Sometimes the old way of doing things still makes sense. They're going to round 00:00:39.509 --> 00:00:42.009 it out with some booths, some picks, and a lot more. 00:00:42.169 --> 00:00:46.089 So before we get there, let's say time-appropriate greetings to our virtual 00:00:46.089 --> 00:00:47.289 lug. Hello, Mumble Room! 00:00:48.529 --> 00:00:50.769 Hey, Chris, hey, Wes, and hello, Brent. 00:00:51.349 --> 00:00:55.389 And let's say hello to that old friend from Tux Digital and this week in Linux, 00:00:55.869 --> 00:00:57.189 Michael Tunnellsbeck. Hello, Michael. 00:00:57.629 --> 00:00:58.749 Hello, everybody. 00:00:59.029 --> 00:01:00.109 It's good to see you. 00:01:00.749 --> 00:01:01.749 Yeah, it's been a while. 00:01:01.969 --> 00:01:06.409 Yeah, we didn't get a chance to see you for our predictions episode because 00:01:06.409 --> 00:01:08.029 you were under the weather. But you're back? 00:01:08.709 --> 00:01:13.269 Not speak so that was that was a bummer because uh i enjoy being the referee you. 00:01:13.269 --> 00:01:15.989 Know yeah well maybe we'll pick it back up next 00:01:15.989 --> 00:01:19.489 year but it's good to see and i think we should maybe we could chat in just 00:01:19.489 --> 00:01:22.569 a moment on a couple of those predictions i mean we might have them here so 00:01:22.569 --> 00:01:28.049 if we wanted to look at them in a moment we could before we get there i want 00:01:28.049 --> 00:01:32.069 to say good morning to our friends over at defined networking go check out manage 00:01:32.069 --> 00:01:35.609 nebula at define.net slash unplugged Now, 00:01:35.709 --> 00:01:38.429 you want a beautiful mesh VPN network these days. 00:01:38.609 --> 00:01:41.029 Everybody knows that because the benefits are incredible. I mean, 00:01:41.109 --> 00:01:44.909 you can connect data centers across multiple different providers and regions, 00:01:44.929 --> 00:01:47.629 your mobile devices, your workstations, your development machines, 00:01:47.749 --> 00:01:50.349 your production machines, and you can create all kinds of privacy with this 00:01:50.349 --> 00:01:52.829 that is just absolutely unbeatable. I mean, I think people understand that. 00:01:54.268 --> 00:01:57.468 But which one is actually the right one to choose? And I say you have to check 00:01:57.468 --> 00:01:59.828 out Define a .NET slash Unplugged. 00:01:59.908 --> 00:02:03.388 It's a decentralized VPN built on the open source Nebula project. 00:02:03.908 --> 00:02:08.388 It's all open source. Top to bottom, if you want to self-host every single component, 00:02:08.388 --> 00:02:10.688 it will always be that way because that's how they build it. 00:02:10.868 --> 00:02:12.868 You want to know what feature's coming down the road? 00:02:13.108 --> 00:02:15.408 Go watch the development right there out in the open on GitHub. 00:02:16.128 --> 00:02:20.548 And then later on, if you decide, I want to completely take this over myself, 00:02:20.548 --> 00:02:22.868 you absolutely can, including some of the essential services. 00:02:22.868 --> 00:02:27.748 But what I think is great is they offer the managed Nebula product so you can get started. 00:02:27.928 --> 00:02:31.468 They host the tough stuff. They do all of that. Later on, if you want to own 00:02:31.468 --> 00:02:35.068 the authentication and you want to own the discovery and all of that, you absolutely can. 00:02:35.668 --> 00:02:38.908 Nebula's decentralized design means there's no single point of failure. 00:02:39.108 --> 00:02:43.608 There's nothing that can happen like on their back end because you can host everything. 00:02:43.808 --> 00:02:46.608 And when you're building something that you want to last five years, 00:02:46.788 --> 00:02:48.448 10 years, you got to think about that. 00:02:48.788 --> 00:02:52.288 It was also from the get-go designed to manage Slack's global infrastructure. 00:02:52.288 --> 00:02:55.148 So you know it's tight, it's powerful, it's super advanced. 00:02:55.328 --> 00:02:57.948 I could tell you all about it, but I think you should go check it out. 00:02:58.028 --> 00:03:00.868 You can get 100 hosts for free, no credit card required, no lock-in, 00:03:00.948 --> 00:03:03.848 define.net slash unplugged. You start with that, then later on you want to go 00:03:03.848 --> 00:03:05.648 set up your own lighthouses? You absolutely can. 00:03:06.848 --> 00:03:10.508 There's no problem. There's no conflict there where you're like part of a big sales funnel. 00:03:10.608 --> 00:03:14.468 Like it's such a great thing because we have heard from so many people out there 00:03:14.468 --> 00:03:17.048 that have deployed it, and they absolutely have been thrilled. 00:03:18.108 --> 00:03:21.348 And probably going to have a little bit more from my end next week. So check it out. 00:03:21.488 --> 00:03:25.548 Go get started. support the show at defined.net slash unplugged. 00:03:25.608 --> 00:03:29.208 And a big thank you to defined.net for sponsoring the Unplugged program. 00:03:32.925 --> 00:03:39.465 Gentlemen, we are on like Donkey Kong for Planet Nix. Get ready. We're going. 00:03:40.285 --> 00:03:43.545 Phlox is helping make it possible again this year. You know Phlox. 00:03:43.645 --> 00:03:46.505 They're focused on making reproducible dev environments actually usable. 00:03:46.865 --> 00:03:51.465 And they're facilitating our trip and Planet Nix. We will have a meetup. 00:03:51.585 --> 00:03:53.425 I think year two is going to be fantastic. 00:03:53.745 --> 00:03:56.805 The call for papers for Planet Nix ends very soon. 00:03:57.105 --> 00:03:59.865 January 15th. So if you're listening to it when this comes out, 00:03:59.965 --> 00:04:02.165 you got a few days. Jan 15th. 00:04:02.925 --> 00:04:07.205 We'll put a link in the show notes. To attend Planet Nix, you need to register for Scale. 00:04:07.445 --> 00:04:11.425 So we'll put a link in there, too. We have a promo code. The promo code is UNPLUG, 00:04:11.625 --> 00:04:15.725 U-N-P-L-G, UNPLUG, and you'll get 40% off your ticket. 00:04:17.105 --> 00:04:21.485 And the remaining value goes to support one of the best open source conferences out there. 00:04:21.545 --> 00:04:24.145 Yeah, and you get access to both Planet Nix and Scale. 00:04:24.585 --> 00:04:27.965 And the expo hall and all the other talks. There's a lot. 00:04:28.425 --> 00:04:32.965 UNPLUG, U-N-P-L-G. We'll have a link to that. We want to see you there. 00:04:33.505 --> 00:04:35.545 This, you know, I think year one of Planet Nix. 00:04:36.465 --> 00:04:39.285 Is this a thing? Is this possible? Can they pull this off? 00:04:40.525 --> 00:04:43.225 Establish it? Yes. Did people like it? We loved it. 00:04:43.505 --> 00:04:46.045 All right, we're doing it again. Now, this year, I think it's going to be a 00:04:46.045 --> 00:04:49.345 lot about building things, talking to people, like people who don't normally 00:04:49.345 --> 00:04:53.985 sit in the same room together, but also still use the same stuff they create. A lot of that. 00:04:54.565 --> 00:04:58.665 And I think it's also going to just pull them or just lead right in to a great scale. 00:04:59.125 --> 00:05:02.845 So why not make it to both? And then just shortly after that, 00:05:04.085 --> 00:05:09.705 LinuxFest Northwest, April 24th to the 26th, back at the Bellingham Technical 00:05:09.705 --> 00:05:12.245 College in the original large expo room. 00:05:12.365 --> 00:05:12.865 Oh. 00:05:13.305 --> 00:05:17.125 Back in the nice area. It's all fixed up. And the LinuxFest Northwest call for 00:05:17.125 --> 00:05:19.085 papers ends tomorrow. Tomorrow. 00:05:20.037 --> 00:05:24.117 at midnight, Monday, January 12th, at midnight. So get it in. 00:05:24.517 --> 00:05:27.257 No promo code for LinuxFest Northwest because it's free. 00:05:28.177 --> 00:05:31.297 Although you can give them a little donation if you want to help support a great event. 00:05:31.697 --> 00:05:36.157 We'll have links to the LinuxFest Northwest call for papers as well. So there you go. 00:05:36.557 --> 00:05:40.697 Planet Nix and Scale. That's happening in March, March 5th through the 6th in 00:05:40.697 --> 00:05:42.957 Pasadena, California. We'd love to see you there. 00:05:43.257 --> 00:05:47.037 And then a little bit after that, LinuxFest Northwest, April 24th through the 00:05:47.037 --> 00:05:52.137 26th. things are shaping up to be a beautiful spring a warm beautiful spring 00:05:52.137 --> 00:05:56.557 in the pacific northwest and then they're saying a hot summer you know have you seen this no. 00:05:56.557 --> 00:05:57.097 I have not. 00:05:57.097 --> 00:06:02.057 Yeah we got a nino transition it's fading out uh you know of dominance as they 00:06:02.057 --> 00:06:05.997 say uh-huh which means it should be a beautiful linux fest northwest so we'd 00:06:05.997 --> 00:06:07.297 love to see you plenty of time to plan. 00:06:07.297 --> 00:06:08.397 Right come on we're telling you now. 00:06:08.397 --> 00:06:11.417 Yep and all the lazy links are in the show notes, 00:06:13.962 --> 00:06:17.542 Well, I just wanted to say a big welcome back to Michael. It's nice to see you, 00:06:17.662 --> 00:06:19.282 sir. Thank you again for making it. 00:06:19.882 --> 00:06:20.622 Thanks for having me. 00:06:21.682 --> 00:06:25.082 Would you love to go back in time and see how you did? I mean, 00:06:25.122 --> 00:06:27.642 would you just love it? Would you just be thrilled? I would love it. 00:06:27.962 --> 00:06:31.742 Actually, I don't remember most of what I said. I remember one of them, 00:06:31.822 --> 00:06:34.782 and I think I was right. And the other ones, I don't remember at all. 00:06:34.882 --> 00:06:38.882 I mean, I did. I don't remember them specifically. But when we were prepping 00:06:38.882 --> 00:06:41.022 for the episode, I reviewed them. And I think you did OK. 00:06:41.202 --> 00:06:42.962 Yeah, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by yourself. 00:06:42.962 --> 00:06:46.022 So, here was Michael's first prediction for 2025. 00:06:46.822 --> 00:06:51.982 I predict that the Cosmic desktop from System76 will make at least a release 00:06:51.982 --> 00:06:54.802 candidate version available in 2025. 00:06:55.402 --> 00:06:56.622 I mean, they made that. 00:06:56.682 --> 00:06:58.102 I was very right. 00:06:58.442 --> 00:07:00.122 Nice. Not bad. 00:07:00.362 --> 00:07:01.722 I forgot about that one entirely. 00:07:03.182 --> 00:07:04.722 You're too busy playing with Cosmic. 00:07:04.762 --> 00:07:06.122 That only really came later in the year. 00:07:06.702 --> 00:07:13.542 Yeah, it was like three weeks before the end of the year. and then like nice yeah. 00:07:13.542 --> 00:07:17.762 All right here was prediction number two for 2025 i. 00:07:17.762 --> 00:07:23.102 Predict that the linux desktop market share will become five percent some point this year. 00:07:23.102 --> 00:07:25.642 I think that one was right too right like everything we can. 00:07:25.642 --> 00:07:26.322 Measure with. 00:07:26.322 --> 00:07:28.702 Seems like that seems like it hit which is. 00:07:28.702 --> 00:07:32.602 Yeah i was i was super shocked uh because that's the one i remembered i was 00:07:32.602 --> 00:07:36.862 like uh because i remember saying like because it was expected to go to four 00:07:36.862 --> 00:07:39.242 and i was like you know i'll just do five anyway and then that actually happened 00:07:39.242 --> 00:07:42.642 it's like wow how was i right okay awesome well. 00:07:42.642 --> 00:07:45.402 You know what i want to know is do you have a prediction for 2026. 00:07:45.402 --> 00:07:50.722 I should but in terms of market share i think it's going to go up to i'm going 00:07:50.722 --> 00:07:53.082 to go ahead and say an extra two percent and say seven all. 00:07:53.082 --> 00:07:57.342 Right all right i like that that was bold all right are you ready for your third and last prediction. 00:07:57.942 --> 00:07:58.562 Yes here. 00:07:58.562 --> 00:08:05.622 We go i predict that in 2025 kde will release a specific desktop operating system 00:08:05.622 --> 00:08:08.482 of their own, regardless of what it's named, 00:08:08.782 --> 00:08:14.362 KDE Linux or not, and it will be at least at a beta release level. 00:08:15.406 --> 00:08:17.826 Now, I don't know. I don't know if they've actually hit beta, have they? 00:08:17.866 --> 00:08:21.446 No, I think I was wrong on that one. I think they hit alpha, not beta. 00:08:21.706 --> 00:08:22.586 Yeah, right. 00:08:22.986 --> 00:08:24.786 That's a bummer. I almost got perfect. 00:08:25.686 --> 00:08:30.386 Okay, here's just a bonus prediction. Do you think they'll hit a 1.0 in 2026? 00:08:30.746 --> 00:08:35.026 I think towards the end of the year, maybe. Yeah. I don't think it's going to 00:08:35.026 --> 00:08:38.286 be anytime soon, but I think they've made a lot of progress. 00:08:38.286 --> 00:08:42.746 I think they've made a lot of progress, enough where they could get to the the 00:08:42.746 --> 00:08:46.546 like I don't know November December era yeah. 00:08:46.546 --> 00:08:47.806 I hope so. 00:08:47.806 --> 00:08:51.926 Although didn't I see they're like doing some debates about sort of the underpinnings 00:08:51.926 --> 00:08:57.406 and should they stick with their like arch sort of inspired thing or adopt other. 00:08:58.046 --> 00:09:01.806 Yeah I think that there's actually potential where they could you know do a 00:09:01.806 --> 00:09:02.966 combination of things like, 00:09:03.726 --> 00:09:06.626 a lot of the effort in the Universal Blue project is super 00:09:06.626 --> 00:09:09.486 interesting because there's there's some effort to make it 00:09:09.486 --> 00:09:12.606 distro-less and that by that meaning um 00:09:12.606 --> 00:09:15.426 it doesn't matter what it's sitting on top of like the 00:09:15.426 --> 00:09:18.366 you could switch out the underneath you know 00:09:18.366 --> 00:09:21.046 fairly easily like just how you can like image mode you can 00:09:21.046 --> 00:09:26.666 switch the desktops pretty quickly it would be uh possible to switch arch to 00:09:26.666 --> 00:09:31.726 fedora or back and forth rebase the base yeah but also the user could do it 00:09:31.726 --> 00:09:35.626 like not even like it's great all you have to do is set up the image mode to 00:09:35.626 --> 00:09:38.886 have that compatibility and it'd be theoretically possible to do that. 00:09:38.886 --> 00:09:39.486 Swap that layer out, huh? 00:09:39.886 --> 00:09:42.506 Yeah, that could also solve that problem. Who knows? 00:09:43.626 --> 00:09:46.766 Wouldn't that be interesting? I'm just thinking about the way OEMs could use that. 00:09:48.226 --> 00:09:54.506 I think the last 10% of KDE Linux is going to be the toughest. So that... 00:09:55.036 --> 00:10:00.716 It might push a 1.0 out to Q1 of 2027. And I don't think that'd be a shame. 00:10:00.876 --> 00:10:04.416 Honestly, I feel like it might be a 1.0 that's not a 1.0. 00:10:04.736 --> 00:10:05.456 Oh, it could be, yeah. 00:10:05.736 --> 00:10:12.356 Yeah. So, like, for example, Cosmix. Cosmix 1.0 was not really ready. 00:10:12.576 --> 00:10:15.656 Like, it's cool. There's a lot of good stuff. 00:10:15.796 --> 00:10:21.656 But there's still some pretty noticeable bugs that would not really count as a 1.0 in that sense. 00:10:21.656 --> 00:10:24.656 And in our space, there is some value to getting it out there in front of users 00:10:24.656 --> 00:10:26.196 and starting to get that feedback. 00:10:26.596 --> 00:10:30.716 Yeah. I also just feel like the idea of the 1.0 is, you know, 00:10:30.796 --> 00:10:34.716 like the version number mattering is like antiquated and no longer matters. 00:10:35.096 --> 00:10:39.796 Like it's like when people talk about like the next version of Linux, 00:10:40.056 --> 00:10:43.056 you know, like Linux 7 is going to come out sometime soon. 00:10:43.876 --> 00:10:48.056 And they're like, well, why is it going to 7? Well, arbitrary number count. 00:10:48.376 --> 00:10:51.496 Like who cares? like it doesn't it's not like they actually choose it for any 00:10:51.496 --> 00:10:56.276 particular reason it's just because they're tired of being six so like now it's seven they. 00:10:56.276 --> 00:10:58.596 Choose it because west predicted it that's usually how it goes. 00:10:58.596 --> 00:11:00.456 Well that that also helps too yeah. 00:11:00.456 --> 00:11:04.596 You know back in my day a point release was like a sign of perhaps a compatibility 00:11:04.596 --> 00:11:06.896 break or a major new feature set. 00:11:06.896 --> 00:11:07.576 Yeah it's. 00:11:07.576 --> 00:11:09.076 Just sort of lost its meaning in that sense. 00:11:09.076 --> 00:11:14.276 Yeah and the major minor bug thing is gone too like it some people use it but 00:11:14.276 --> 00:11:20.676 it also doesn't matter anymore yeah so like uh ubuntu helped create that to go away with the dates. 00:11:21.276 --> 00:11:24.596 So now we have like the major minor, but it's really just like, 00:11:24.716 --> 00:11:25.576 it's an update. Who cares? 00:11:26.076 --> 00:11:29.656 Yeah, I wonder, one day we'll have Linux 2810. Linux, you know, 00:11:29.776 --> 00:11:31.096 whatever. Whatever we'll have. 00:11:31.796 --> 00:11:35.796 All right, well, we are gathered here today because we, as a world, 00:11:37.976 --> 00:11:43.876 of technology enthusiasts, are faced with the plight of incredibly high storage prices. 00:11:45.116 --> 00:11:48.216 I really missed the boat on this one. I don't know how many of you were feeling 00:11:48.216 --> 00:11:51.616 this way, but I, of course, was, if you guys remember, we were talking about 00:11:51.616 --> 00:11:54.976 low power home labs towards the end of last year, started around October, November. 00:11:56.611 --> 00:12:00.451 Boy, should I have bought then. So I did a little digging before the show, 00:12:00.571 --> 00:12:04.931 guys, and it's real bad out there. So... 00:12:06.460 --> 00:12:13.720 The worst price increases seem to be in like the kind of nicer SSDs and MVMEs 00:12:13.720 --> 00:12:15.700 in the two terabyte and up range. 00:12:15.920 --> 00:12:18.960 I don't see a lot of punishment in the one terabyte. But for example, 00:12:19.060 --> 00:12:27.600 the Western Digital Black SN850X two terabyte drive is up 80 percent since October. Since October. 00:12:27.900 --> 00:12:28.600 Since October. 00:12:29.120 --> 00:12:32.800 That's not 10 percent. That's not 20 percent. No. Over 50 percent. 00:12:32.920 --> 00:12:35.420 And because I'm in a moving vehicle, I was looking for solid state. 00:12:35.420 --> 00:12:39.660 So I at first had my eye on an 8-terabyte NVMe, which would be just enough. 00:12:39.800 --> 00:12:41.080 And that thing went from it. 00:12:41.120 --> 00:12:42.100 I mean, that sounds expensive already. 00:12:42.340 --> 00:12:47.280 Yeah. But I think it was like $700, $800. And now it's between $14 and $1,600 00:12:47.280 --> 00:12:48.400 depending on the vendor. 00:12:49.540 --> 00:12:49.980 Wow. 00:12:50.480 --> 00:12:51.580 And the other thing is. 00:12:51.880 --> 00:12:53.480 Do I want a laptop or a hard drive? 00:12:53.700 --> 00:12:58.600 The number of vendors even supplying to the consumer market is less. 00:12:58.600 --> 00:13:04.600 I did a little comparison shopping on Camel, Camel, Camel of SSD vendors selling 00:13:04.600 --> 00:13:10.900 two terabyte drives back in October, and there were probably 30 of them. And now there's two. 00:13:11.860 --> 00:13:14.860 So it's brutal out there. 00:13:15.140 --> 00:13:18.660 And it's just gone from something that was kind of cheap to just this precious 00:13:18.660 --> 00:13:23.840 commodity, obviously because enterprise data centers, those types of AI jobs, 00:13:23.960 --> 00:13:24.900 they're all eating up storage. 00:13:25.060 --> 00:13:28.700 They're buying inventory before they've even been produced. Some of these vendors 00:13:28.700 --> 00:13:32.800 are making exclusivity deals with these larger data centers to provide them 00:13:32.800 --> 00:13:34.640 with, you know, their storage chips. 00:13:35.400 --> 00:13:40.960 So I think each one of us have probably been thinking about this problem a little bit. 00:13:41.340 --> 00:13:44.220 I don't know if anybody – you know, we always are – our storage needs are always growing. 00:13:44.400 --> 00:13:47.580 So I thought we'd go around the horn and kind of talk about if we had any ideas 00:13:47.580 --> 00:13:54.760 for sort of stretching out or getting cheap storage for 2026, maybe even into 2027. 00:13:54.760 --> 00:13:59.720 Some of the things I was looking at here suggest we already have back orders 00:13:59.720 --> 00:14:05.260 now on the books up to 24 months from the AI data centers. 00:14:06.515 --> 00:14:11.075 And so they are going to be filling the data center inventory for 24 months 00:14:11.075 --> 00:14:12.995 at least, and that's the existing back. 00:14:13.055 --> 00:14:16.535 Now, some of that might get canceled if things decline or whatever, 00:14:16.535 --> 00:14:22.575 but the projection is at least until 2027, we're going to have a massive crunch in storage prices. 00:14:24.095 --> 00:14:28.595 So, Michael, do you have any thoughts on ways to stretch your existing storage 00:14:28.595 --> 00:14:30.575 or cheap storage acquisition strategies? 00:14:30.895 --> 00:14:32.955 Are you going to be shucking USB disks? 00:14:33.115 --> 00:14:34.875 Do you have any hard drives we can have? 00:14:36.695 --> 00:14:39.475 So actually as you were talking about it i was thinking about it 00:14:39.475 --> 00:14:42.235 and uh you got that 00:14:42.235 --> 00:14:45.095 sweet storage i i was actually thinking about 00:14:45.095 --> 00:14:48.355 it as you were mentioning you were describing this problem and i was thinking 00:14:48.355 --> 00:14:53.495 like you know at this point ssds are probably around the same or if not more 00:14:53.495 --> 00:14:59.055 value than gold so so i was thinking like maybe i should sell some of my ssds 00:14:59.055 --> 00:15:03.675 you know and get some like like some like five-year-old ssds are now worth double 00:15:03.675 --> 00:15:04.735 what they were or whatever, 00:15:05.395 --> 00:15:08.235 and uh and but it's actually 00:15:08.235 --> 00:15:11.195 kind of funny because i was you know debating whether or 00:15:11.195 --> 00:15:14.275 not i should upgrade my hard drives for my 00:15:14.275 --> 00:15:17.095 nas because i got i recently got a bigger nas 00:15:17.095 --> 00:15:20.235 so like i had a four bay and now i have an eight bay and then 00:15:20.235 --> 00:15:22.835 i was thinking like okay i need to you know 00:15:22.835 --> 00:15:26.715 figure out a time where i need to get some more drives and 00:15:26.715 --> 00:15:29.435 then i looked at the prices like you know what i can 00:15:29.435 --> 00:15:32.475 wait a little bit i'll come back into it like a couple months and 00:15:32.475 --> 00:15:37.935 then the storage price hit same and yeah it's completely destroyed all plans 00:15:37.935 --> 00:15:43.135 so like i'm now not only am i not i'm not even using that new bay anymore i'm 00:15:43.135 --> 00:15:48.075 using the still using old four bay uh just because it's not worth even bothering 00:15:48.075 --> 00:15:51.915 to move the stuff and now i'm just in the process of like. 00:15:52.768 --> 00:15:55.608 Figuring out like it used to be uh you know storage is 00:15:55.608 --> 00:15:58.748 cheap i'll just get whatever i need and then i'll just keep everything 00:15:58.748 --> 00:16:01.508 now i'm just deciding whether i want to keep the stuff or not 00:16:01.508 --> 00:16:05.168 like some of the stuff i've had for 20 years 00:16:05.168 --> 00:16:08.908 yeah and i've not never looked at it ever because 00:16:08.908 --> 00:16:12.708 i have a i had a rule i don't need more i've already i've already established 00:16:12.708 --> 00:16:17.668 this and i've gone i've i've pulled the trigger on this situation to save my 00:16:17.668 --> 00:16:23.588 storage and uh i used to have a philosophy of everything I create as a creative 00:16:23.588 --> 00:16:26.528 person and graphic design and everything, I keep everything. 00:16:26.868 --> 00:16:28.968 Yeah, totally get that, right? You don't want to have it later, 00:16:29.028 --> 00:16:32.448 you're like, I had that, I made that, I burned hours of my life investing in 00:16:32.448 --> 00:16:36.468 creating that to throw it away when I could have just had that one more FLAC file? Come on. 00:16:36.988 --> 00:16:40.408 Exactly. And also, it goes back to when I was doing graphic design. 00:16:40.508 --> 00:16:44.748 So I have all the PSD files and I have everything. So I have the completed project 00:16:44.748 --> 00:16:46.988 and the source project and everything. 00:16:47.448 --> 00:16:51.548 And I've gotten to the point where now, So some of that stuff I still keep, 00:16:51.628 --> 00:16:54.308 even if it's super old, just because of like, I just want it. 00:16:54.648 --> 00:16:59.368 But when it comes to video, and doing like video on YouTube, 00:16:59.728 --> 00:17:05.708 and you know, the podcasting and stuff, and there's been, there's just so much data that takes up. 00:17:06.367 --> 00:17:10.807 And I was thinking, like, do I have I ever gone back and done a montage of like 00:17:10.807 --> 00:17:13.587 previous episodes or anything? Have I ever used that stuff? 00:17:13.867 --> 00:17:18.387 And no, I have not. So I just basically deleted half of the storage. 00:17:18.747 --> 00:17:21.787 And now I actually have the NAS available to use again. 00:17:21.987 --> 00:17:26.327 Yeah, because I was I was super close to having nothing on the on no storage 00:17:26.327 --> 00:17:28.887 on the NAS. And now I have like half of it back. 00:17:29.087 --> 00:17:34.747 So I'm actually kind of happy I did that because I would have just bought new storage. 00:17:34.747 --> 00:17:37.887 I don't I'm not saying that it's good that this happened 00:17:37.887 --> 00:17:43.607 that forced me to do this but I am happy that uh I'm I've kind of gotten past 00:17:43.607 --> 00:17:48.687 this threshold of like not holding on to everything because I I'm a very minimal 00:17:48.687 --> 00:17:53.887 person in reality but in terms of digital hoarder yep that would I'm very much 00:17:53.887 --> 00:17:56.567 a digital hoarder so I think that's a fair point there is. 00:17:56.567 --> 00:18:01.447 It is really easy to slip into digital hoarding um and and just you save everything 00:18:01.447 --> 00:18:05.387 and and you constantly are adding to it more and more, which is kind of fun, 00:18:05.547 --> 00:18:07.187 but gets very expensive right now. 00:18:08.047 --> 00:18:12.207 Yeah. So I'm kind of not with like project files, but I'm on the other end of 00:18:12.207 --> 00:18:16.267 I spent probably the last five years being I'll just delete it guy. 00:18:17.107 --> 00:18:22.187 And then a couple of months ago, a few months ago, I was starting to plan for 00:18:22.187 --> 00:18:26.487 my daughter's birthday and I wanted to get her that I wanted to show her this 00:18:26.487 --> 00:18:30.027 movie that I had deleted, but I figured what's the big deal? 00:18:30.147 --> 00:18:34.907 I'll just download it again. could not actually find a working way to get it again. 00:18:35.027 --> 00:18:39.567 And so I went and bought the DVD and ripped it and started thinking, 00:18:39.947 --> 00:18:42.027 you know, there's a few things I started going through my library and thinking 00:18:42.027 --> 00:18:44.847 there's a few things that I ripped by hand that I either think are better quality 00:18:44.847 --> 00:18:49.067 or like I can't necessarily find an easy way to find them again online. 00:18:50.427 --> 00:18:54.327 And I started thinking maybe there is some stuff I do want to keep forever. 00:18:55.407 --> 00:19:00.147 And then if that's the case, I got a real problem here because I'm already almost 00:19:00.147 --> 00:19:02.227 out of storage. There is some stuff I absolutely will delete. 00:19:03.820 --> 00:19:05.360 There are some things I want to keep. 00:19:05.520 --> 00:19:08.600 Yeah, no, I'm kind of in the same place. Like I have been trying to keep, 00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:12.120 I haven't, not for the last few years, but before that I was moving around a 00:19:12.120 --> 00:19:15.740 lot and it was just like, didn't make sense to have a giant NAS keeping everything. 00:19:15.740 --> 00:19:18.080 So I've kind of been pruning, but you're right. 00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:21.320 We're entering now a digital landscape where I've been thinking about it for, 00:19:21.500 --> 00:19:23.940 like with the, I don't know if you've seen some of the numbers people are passing 00:19:23.940 --> 00:19:25.640 around for like the death of stack overflow. 00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:26.220 Yeah. 00:19:26.520 --> 00:19:29.580 But there's just a lot of stuff on there. Not that it isn't elsewhere, 00:19:29.580 --> 00:19:33.560 but especially even for some things like, like there's like the math overflow part. 00:19:33.560 --> 00:19:37.040 There's some nice write-ups or ways that people express things or taught things, 00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:40.240 just things that I've kind of always relied on existing out there in the internet, 00:19:40.240 --> 00:19:43.120 whether it be on the media side or just on the information side, 00:19:43.120 --> 00:19:46.660 that we're getting to a new era. 00:19:46.660 --> 00:19:49.020 And it seems like a lot of that stuff, some of it will be kept, 00:19:49.160 --> 00:19:51.920 some of it will hit the internet archive, but a lot of it just won't. 00:19:52.020 --> 00:19:56.500 And if I don't take action and have some dedicated storage for it, 00:19:56.800 --> 00:19:58.640 it might just vanish. Yeah. 00:19:58.980 --> 00:20:01.600 And then I've also digitized more things with paperless and whatnot, 00:20:01.600 --> 00:20:03.580 which also brings in backups to this, Brent. 00:20:03.680 --> 00:20:07.000 And I don't know if you've thought much about this, but with storage going up, 00:20:07.100 --> 00:20:09.780 it makes strategies like, oh, I'll just buy another hard drive. 00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:13.100 I'll buy this hard drive, copy everything over, then send it off-site. 00:20:13.180 --> 00:20:14.460 Well, maybe not with the expense now. 00:20:15.260 --> 00:20:17.960 Yeah. I mean, that was my strategy up till now. And now I'm thinking, 00:20:18.180 --> 00:20:24.840 holy, I got to get my act in gear because if I all of a sudden decide I have 00:20:24.840 --> 00:20:26.820 to move to used drives, for instance. 00:20:28.120 --> 00:20:31.980 I don't know. You tell me if I'm right or not. But that feels like the risk 00:20:31.980 --> 00:20:35.280 is higher. So maybe I do need extra bays in my NAS. 00:20:35.440 --> 00:20:38.740 And maybe I do need to have a better RAID system. And maybe I do need, 00:20:38.880 --> 00:20:41.740 you know, more offside backups and stuff because hard drives are going to fail. 00:20:42.160 --> 00:20:46.540 Used drives are getting more expensive, too. I did a little eBay slinking trying to find a cheap. 00:20:46.700 --> 00:20:50.280 And you can, I mean, you'll save money. But like you said, you don't know the quality. 00:20:50.680 --> 00:20:54.360 And yeah, like they're still not as cheap as they used to be. 00:20:54.360 --> 00:20:58.140 And here I thought 2026 was naively going to be the year I finally got a proper 00:20:58.140 --> 00:20:59.620 backup system for my folks going. 00:20:59.900 --> 00:21:02.760 I know. So, yeah, Brian, it's like not even used storage. 00:21:04.669 --> 00:21:06.289 Well, I do have a bunch in my basement 00:21:06.289 --> 00:21:09.909 that I forgot about that I could probably get back out of the ice. 00:21:10.349 --> 00:21:12.249 Slam it all into a scary raid, you know? 00:21:12.409 --> 00:21:15.589 I think the worst part is that now this whole thing has happened. 00:21:15.909 --> 00:21:20.489 And I have just a few sitting over here for like, you know, drives that I've 00:21:20.489 --> 00:21:26.409 done for testing of like distros and stuff that even they're 256 gig or 512 00:21:26.409 --> 00:21:28.809 gig. And they're now looking super appealing. 00:21:29.229 --> 00:21:33.929 Like, oh, wow, I actually have stuff I can use, even though it's super tiny, too. 00:21:33.929 --> 00:21:37.189 I know, I was looking at, like, SATA controllers with, like, eight ports on them. 00:21:37.209 --> 00:21:40.249 I'm like, I could slam one of these in and just attach a bunch of random drives 00:21:40.249 --> 00:21:43.849 and then just smash it all together. And then one of them will eventually pop, but... 00:21:43.849 --> 00:21:48.209 All right, you get a bunch of Raspberry Pis, and then you plug in a bunch of sort of USB expanders. 00:21:48.229 --> 00:21:50.689 And then you put in a bunch of flash drives, and then you put that all into 00:21:50.689 --> 00:21:53.189 a CEPH cluster. And then you just store everything there. 00:21:53.309 --> 00:21:57.129 Well, why not cut out the middleman and get a USB hub and just attach a whole 00:21:57.129 --> 00:21:59.909 bunch of SD card readers all to the USB hub? 00:21:59.969 --> 00:22:00.429 Oh, good point, yeah. 00:22:00.829 --> 00:22:00.969 Yeah. 00:22:01.469 --> 00:22:02.569 Those are so thin, right? 00:22:02.569 --> 00:22:05.629 It like it'll stack well yeah it's essentially solid. 00:22:05.629 --> 00:22:12.929 I would assume this is all you know hard drives and memory and ssd is all being 00:22:12.929 --> 00:22:16.009 consumed by like the you know ai push right the. 00:22:16.009 --> 00:22:16.649 Big machine yeah. 00:22:16.649 --> 00:22:20.149 But i was thinking about this a little bit more this morning and, 00:22:21.290 --> 00:22:26.590 You know, they're going to be pushing their hard drives out of the pipeline at some point, right? 00:22:26.630 --> 00:22:29.590 They're not just going to hoard every single hard drive that they're using. 00:22:30.070 --> 00:22:33.330 I feel like they're going to destroy them, though. Like, they're going to use 00:22:33.330 --> 00:22:37.050 them to a degree. Like, you know, like the crypto miners made the GPUs worthless. 00:22:37.330 --> 00:22:39.810 I feel like they're going to make their drives worthless. 00:22:40.170 --> 00:22:43.410 Yeah. Although, like, some vendors may have an age-out strategy. 00:22:44.070 --> 00:22:47.950 Hmm. You could still see. Like, I could still see, even if not all of them. 00:22:47.950 --> 00:22:53.170 If only like, say, 30% of them made it on the market, in the used market, 00:22:53.430 --> 00:22:54.990 there are outlets that specialize. 00:22:55.250 --> 00:22:57.830 And that's one of the ones I looked into, by the way, is there are outlets that 00:22:57.830 --> 00:23:02.670 specialize in they go buy them from the data centers and guarantee like they 00:23:02.670 --> 00:23:05.630 wipe everything and they have like a whole contract. And then they resell them 00:23:05.630 --> 00:23:07.450 in bundles, like massive bundles. 00:23:08.290 --> 00:23:09.590 So that could be a thing. 00:23:10.090 --> 00:23:14.070 The nice thing, too, with some of this, right, like, unlike GPUs, 00:23:14.270 --> 00:23:18.130 I mean, if it was cheaper, you could also, if it was cheaper but sketchy, 00:23:18.170 --> 00:23:19.630 you could up the redundancy, right? 00:23:19.750 --> 00:23:20.190 Oh, true. 00:23:20.330 --> 00:23:23.030 I'm going to build two arrays. I'm going to have double copies because I don't 00:23:23.030 --> 00:23:25.150 really trust either of them, and I don't want to do a giant. 00:23:25.450 --> 00:23:27.730 So that could be a future thing where use storage comes down, 00:23:27.830 --> 00:23:31.010 but as of right now, it's still pretty expensive, and you're rolling the dice. 00:23:31.090 --> 00:23:32.390 So it's sort of a double whammy. 00:23:32.390 --> 00:23:35.750 There's also something to be said for not every 00:23:35.750 --> 00:23:38.610 single ai company that's buying all this stuff up right 00:23:38.610 --> 00:23:41.810 now because they somehow have free money uh is 00:23:41.810 --> 00:23:47.230 going to survive so we might see like these big splashes of hardware just hitting 00:23:47.230 --> 00:23:50.070 the used market all of a sudden so if you're looking you might be able to find 00:23:50.070 --> 00:23:55.870 that stuff i don't imagine it'll be a constant you know stream of what we want 00:23:55.870 --> 00:23:58.890 to be consuming in terms of hardware but it might happen. 00:24:00.428 --> 00:24:03.528 Yeah, they may not all be consumer end products, but if you're okay dealing 00:24:03.528 --> 00:24:05.188 with SaaS or whatever, it might work. 00:24:06.028 --> 00:24:11.528 But I do think there is something we can do about it because there is an area 00:24:11.528 --> 00:24:15.388 of the market that these data centers are just not gobbling up. 00:24:15.388 --> 00:24:16.688 They have no interest in. 00:24:16.948 --> 00:24:18.928 It still provides a good means of storage. 00:24:19.548 --> 00:24:21.588 You're talking about magnetic tape. 00:24:22.108 --> 00:24:27.108 I looked at that. I did. If anybody knows a place to find a tape drive that's 00:24:27.108 --> 00:24:30.468 reliable for under $500, let me know. but all the ones I saw. 00:24:30.548 --> 00:24:30.648 Floppy disks. 00:24:31.588 --> 00:24:34.468 Floppy disks. Yes. Now here's what I'm thinking. 00:24:35.708 --> 00:24:38.528 The solution comes from the nineties and that's optical media. 00:24:38.768 --> 00:24:44.628 We channel our inner nineties kids and I think we look back at optical media. 00:24:44.628 --> 00:24:46.448 I think it, I think it holds the solution. 00:24:46.848 --> 00:24:50.248 And so gentlemen, I have been inspired and I have an idea. 00:24:53.194 --> 00:24:56.594 Join crowdhealth.com and use the promo code unplugged. 00:24:56.754 --> 00:25:01.054 The health insurance process is confusing. It leaves me feeling like I was taken 00:25:01.054 --> 00:25:05.594 advantage of and it was extremely hard to navigate and even make an economically 00:25:05.594 --> 00:25:09.414 reasonable choice with my wife and I both being self-employed. 00:25:09.494 --> 00:25:11.914 And every year the rates keep going up. 00:25:12.014 --> 00:25:15.534 And the system itself is fundamentally twisted. It's in the States, 00:25:15.694 --> 00:25:19.094 it's attached to employment, which is just really complicated. 00:25:19.254 --> 00:25:24.194 And honestly, some of us, like myself, have just opted out. 00:25:24.354 --> 00:25:27.634 And for over three years, I have been a member of CrowdHealth. 00:25:28.034 --> 00:25:31.234 Making informed decisions, especially about your health, isn't easy. 00:25:31.334 --> 00:25:35.334 And so it took me a bit of time and research before I came to this decision. 00:25:35.514 --> 00:25:38.934 But more than three years in, I'm really glad I did. 00:25:39.514 --> 00:25:43.654 CrowdHealth isn't regular insurance. It's not like that at all. 00:25:43.774 --> 00:25:46.514 It's a community of people funding each other's medical bills directly. 00:25:46.754 --> 00:25:50.194 There's no middleman. There's nobody constantly taking more and more profit. 00:25:50.334 --> 00:25:52.094 There's no networks that you have to be inside. 00:25:52.254 --> 00:25:55.994 There's just no nonsense at all. It's health care for under $100. 00:25:56.454 --> 00:26:00.994 That's CrowdHealth, the health insurance alternative. You get access to a team 00:26:00.994 --> 00:26:04.354 of health bill negotiators, low-cost prescriptions, lab testing tools, 00:26:04.414 --> 00:26:08.434 and a database of low-cost, high-quality doctors that have been vetted by CrowdHealth. 00:26:08.574 --> 00:26:09.274 They've worked with them. 00:26:09.454 --> 00:26:12.854 It's really smooth. They have a fantastic app to navigate it all, 00:26:13.114 --> 00:26:16.954 plus great customer service, people you can chat with on the phone or via text. 00:26:17.574 --> 00:26:22.034 And when something major happens, you pay the first $500 and then the crowd 00:26:22.034 --> 00:26:23.654 steps in and helps fund the rest. 00:26:24.254 --> 00:26:27.994 It's sort of like the options we used to have before it all got messed up and 00:26:27.994 --> 00:26:30.374 seemed to get worse every single year. 00:26:30.794 --> 00:26:34.914 So you'll join the crowd, a group of members just like me, who want to help 00:26:34.914 --> 00:26:36.974 pay for each other's unexpected medical events. 00:26:37.094 --> 00:26:40.054 And people are incentivized to take care of each other in this incentive and 00:26:40.054 --> 00:26:41.154 take care of themselves. 00:26:42.781 --> 00:26:44.981 The system's betting that you're just going to stay stuck, and you're just going 00:26:44.981 --> 00:26:48.121 to keep paying the same more and more overpriced, complicated mess. 00:26:48.761 --> 00:26:51.821 And this year, it's getting even worse because a lot of the subsidies are expiring, 00:26:52.021 --> 00:26:54.161 and so the costs are going to go up even more. 00:26:54.441 --> 00:26:58.261 So far, CrowdHealth members have saved $40 million in health care expenses because 00:26:58.261 --> 00:27:02.201 they refuse to overpay. I, myself, have saved somewhere around $3,200. 00:27:03.441 --> 00:27:06.801 It's really powerful stuff, and it's time to take your power back. 00:27:06.801 --> 00:27:11.681 Join CrowdHealth at joincrowdhealth.com and use our promo code unplugged today 00:27:11.681 --> 00:27:14.361 for your first three months at only $99. 00:27:15.161 --> 00:27:20.001 That's right. Joincrowdhealth.com promo code unplugged. CrowdHealth, it's not insurance. 00:27:20.201 --> 00:27:23.501 It's time to opt out and take your power back. This is how we win. 00:27:23.701 --> 00:27:27.601 It's joincrowdhealth.com and use that promo code unplugged. 00:27:30.205 --> 00:27:33.105 Chris, I'll admit when I first heard you talking about this idea, 00:27:33.365 --> 00:27:37.245 I thought it was pretty crazy because I thought we had left those little spinning 00:27:37.245 --> 00:27:38.785 things of plastic behind. 00:27:39.005 --> 00:27:41.745 Like, I have a drawer full somewhere, though, if you need some. 00:27:42.565 --> 00:27:46.885 But now I, after doing a little research, I kind of see where you're going with this. 00:27:47.005 --> 00:27:50.985 It's, you know, I'm feeling a little nostalgic from their 90s times. 00:27:51.245 --> 00:27:54.985 It is fun. It does have some nostalgia. Physical media, it's back. 00:27:55.185 --> 00:27:57.085 It's still a thing and it's cheap. 00:27:58.425 --> 00:28:03.445 So the seed oil of this idea was after last week's Linux Unplugged, 00:28:03.585 --> 00:28:09.585 Wes and I were checking out the DVD drive that I bought to restore or re-rip 00:28:09.585 --> 00:28:12.525 stuff from the original DVD since I deleted it and then wanted it back. 00:28:13.185 --> 00:28:16.205 And we were checking it out and I needed something to test it with and I wanted 00:28:16.205 --> 00:28:19.665 to see if it worked with Linux and see if the USB bus could power it enough and all this. 00:28:20.185 --> 00:28:25.425 So I'm searching the whole freaking studio and I cannot find any physical media. I'm like, wow. 00:28:25.745 --> 00:28:30.405 In my mind, I can picture where I used to store DVDs. But of course, that was a decade ago. 00:28:31.005 --> 00:28:38.165 So I find an old CDR in a box of old studio stuff and something I burnt a long 00:28:38.165 --> 00:28:39.985 time ago. And it's like data backup on there. 00:28:40.565 --> 00:28:43.545 And I vaguely recall doing this. 00:28:43.665 --> 00:28:47.265 So I bring it in, pop it in the new drive and it mounts and I see it. 00:28:47.405 --> 00:28:54.965 And I start looking at the contents on there. And it's a backup of the Office 2000 installer. 00:28:55.185 --> 00:28:57.085 That's right. Oh, that was so good. 00:28:57.265 --> 00:29:02.865 I burned this CD-R in early 2000, 26 years ago. 00:29:04.229 --> 00:29:06.669 And it was just there, sitting, waiting this whole time. 00:29:06.749 --> 00:29:07.649 Just worked perfectly. 00:29:08.029 --> 00:29:08.729 No way. 00:29:08.949 --> 00:29:13.809 And it struck me as, well, that's about as best case scenario as I can expect. Right? 00:29:14.289 --> 00:29:16.669 Now, admittedly, we didn't try installing Windows. 00:29:16.729 --> 00:29:22.009 No. We didn't check Summit. That's true. We didn't try installing Office 2000. 00:29:22.389 --> 00:29:25.629 But it just got me thinking, like, wow, that really held up. 00:29:25.849 --> 00:29:30.309 And then throughout the week, I realized, well, this DVD drive can burn Blu-rays. 00:29:31.269 --> 00:29:33.729 And then I started thinking, well, let's go take a look at this. 00:29:34.229 --> 00:29:35.509 I'm running out of storage. 00:29:35.729 --> 00:29:40.189 Well, you can buy a 50 gigabyte Blu-ray disc. 00:29:40.349 --> 00:29:49.189 In fact, you can buy a pack of 10 50 gig Blu-ray discs for 18 US dollars. 00:29:50.589 --> 00:29:57.569 You can buy 100 discs at Newegg for under $160. So on the low end. 00:29:58.069 --> 00:30:00.109 They still manufacture them? I don't believe this. 00:30:00.469 --> 00:30:03.529 Wow. So say you get that Newegg deal, right? you're essentially 00:30:03.529 --> 00:30:06.549 buying usable storage about 4.6 terabytes 00:30:06.549 --> 00:30:09.649 of usable storage and so that works out to be about three 00:30:09.649 --> 00:30:12.629 cents a gigabyte you could 00:30:12.629 --> 00:30:15.529 of course get an ssd at a pretty but you know those are pretty expensive so 00:30:15.529 --> 00:30:21.569 you can buy these bundles of blu-ray discs at 50 gigs a pop i mean it's going 00:30:21.569 --> 00:30:26.049 to take a while but this is like an area that the data centers don't don't care 00:30:26.049 --> 00:30:29.769 about they're they're not driving these prices up and then you have something 00:30:29.769 --> 00:30:34.349 that could potentially sit on a shelf for 26 years and if you ever needed it back. 00:30:34.349 --> 00:30:37.329 I mean so I guess you gotta go through the effort of doing the burning. 00:30:37.329 --> 00:30:38.049 Yep and. 00:30:38.049 --> 00:30:39.289 Maybe the restoring or the. 00:30:39.289 --> 00:30:42.369 Validating don't lose it and don't forget what files on what and probably. 00:30:42.369 --> 00:30:44.729 Ideally you wanna make sure you've got it in some sort of storage where it's 00:30:44.729 --> 00:30:46.509 not gonna get scratched and you know whatever, 00:30:48.258 --> 00:30:54.978 But, I mean, I remember the eras, like I remember copying stuff for friends, et cetera. 00:30:55.178 --> 00:30:58.518 Like, I have gone through the motions of burning a fair amount of disks, 00:30:58.638 --> 00:31:02.298 right? So, like, it is doable, and you probably use them in the computer anyway, 00:31:02.378 --> 00:31:04.218 so, like, you kind of just do it while you're doing other things. 00:31:04.798 --> 00:31:08.878 And if you do it right, you know, like in the case of this CDR I backed up in 00:31:08.878 --> 00:31:13.778 the year 2000, if it's just files on a file system, and you don't require some 00:31:13.778 --> 00:31:16.438 specific app to, like, decrypt and restore it, 00:31:17.358 --> 00:31:21.098 then future you can just drag and drop the files when you want to restore it 00:31:21.098 --> 00:31:23.518 when you want them maybe you only want one file or something like that. 00:31:23.518 --> 00:31:27.798 But that does bring up keeping track of like there is that because if you're 00:31:27.798 --> 00:31:31.498 gonna have it like the units are smaller right so you'll have more units and 00:31:31.498 --> 00:31:35.198 so yeah if you don't do a good job labeling or whatever then you're like well 00:31:35.198 --> 00:31:37.338 where's wait i need for the photos from which year. 00:31:38.385 --> 00:31:41.925 We also have much better compression algorithms these days than we used to. 00:31:42.105 --> 00:31:45.905 So I feel like you could fit even more info on those disks than you're comparing. 00:31:46.365 --> 00:31:52.325 That's very true. So I set out to find a tool to help me achieve this job. 00:31:52.605 --> 00:31:56.605 How hard could this be, right? I looked at Borg Backup. 00:31:56.745 --> 00:32:00.165 I looked at Bacula, too, considering maybe I would actually just accomplish 00:32:00.165 --> 00:32:01.665 this with a traditional backup tool. 00:32:01.825 --> 00:32:04.545 Because you bring up a good point, Wes, is like the key thing is, 00:32:04.685 --> 00:32:09.845 say my kids come to me two years from now, and they say, Dad, we want to watch X. 00:32:10.385 --> 00:32:15.745 And, well, how the hell do I know out of these 15 Blu-rays where that one file is? 00:32:15.965 --> 00:32:20.425 And if you're backing up a TV series, it could be larger than 50 gigabytes or something like that. 00:32:20.625 --> 00:32:23.405 It's even worse if it's a bunch of small files. They're like, 00:32:23.485 --> 00:32:26.785 oh, I need the, which, okay, where did I put the taxes for this year? 00:32:27.025 --> 00:32:30.905 Oh, God, yeah. Yeah, because paperless is also another thing in here and all of that. 00:32:31.085 --> 00:32:35.145 So, ladies and gentlemen, I could not find a tool, so I have made a tool, 00:32:35.185 --> 00:32:37.445 and it is called Blue Vault. 00:32:37.705 --> 00:32:46.025 That's right. It's a Rust-based app, a TUI, with sort of an 80s theme for managing Blu-ray archives. 00:32:46.265 --> 00:32:52.725 And the basic idea is you attach a USB Blu-ray burner, which are like $50 these 00:32:52.725 --> 00:32:55.485 days, US dollars. You bring up this TUI. 00:32:56.407 --> 00:32:59.767 And it walks you through archiving individual folders to a Blu-ray disk. 00:32:59.847 --> 00:33:02.527 And it supports 25 gig, 50 gig, and 100 gigabyte disks. 00:33:03.127 --> 00:33:07.087 I just this morning added multi-disk architecture. So that's very new. 00:33:07.307 --> 00:33:10.067 So there's two different releases. Release one is single-disk architecture. 00:33:10.507 --> 00:33:15.487 Release two is multi-disk architecture. It generates a table of contents and 00:33:15.487 --> 00:33:17.767 a SQL database where all of the files are. 00:33:17.927 --> 00:33:22.687 It does a SHA-256 sum and a CRC-325 sum of all of the files. 00:33:22.787 --> 00:33:26.567 So you can verify them later. It offers two different burn methods, 00:33:26.767 --> 00:33:30.267 burns directly to Blu-ray or just create an ISO image. 00:33:30.727 --> 00:33:34.667 And it has an optional QR code generator. So if you wanted to label the disk 00:33:34.667 --> 00:33:36.787 or the jewel case with a QR code, you could. 00:33:36.987 --> 00:33:40.227 It has a verify mode, which is very nice. 00:33:40.327 --> 00:33:42.747 It also will do a dry run if you just want to go through a dry run. 00:33:42.827 --> 00:33:46.347 It's using like R-Sync on the back end and a bunch of standard Linux burning tools. 00:33:46.467 --> 00:33:51.347 So really, I just created the TUI to set on top of this. And the Tui has a phosphorus 00:33:51.347 --> 00:33:54.247 green, high contrast, black on green. 00:33:54.427 --> 00:33:57.367 But it's easy to read. Like the stuff you're supposed to look at is obvious and highlighted. 00:33:58.667 --> 00:34:02.407 Monospace type. It's really nice. Subtle animations. And one of the things I 00:34:02.407 --> 00:34:07.587 worked on, although it's not perfect, is I really tried to constantly give you as much feedback. 00:34:07.987 --> 00:34:12.107 Because there's some processes that are just like when you're generating a shot, 00:34:12.207 --> 00:34:14.027 like it can take a little bit in the background. 00:34:14.167 --> 00:34:17.427 Right. Or if you're if you're moving an MKV file to a Blu-ray, 00:34:17.647 --> 00:34:22.287 it can take a little bit. So I've tried to give the UI as much responsiveness 00:34:22.287 --> 00:34:24.187 and updates as to what it's doing as possible. 00:34:25.027 --> 00:34:28.527 And then the thing I just added this morning, well, technically late last night. 00:34:30.371 --> 00:34:34.131 Is the multi-disc archive. Because obviously you're going to have issues where 00:34:34.131 --> 00:34:37.151 you want to back up something that's larger than 50 gigabytes or something like that. 00:34:37.311 --> 00:34:40.371 And so what I'm trying to do here is preserve the folder integrity. 00:34:40.651 --> 00:34:45.231 So it's not doing like a par split or something like that where it's lumping 00:34:45.231 --> 00:34:46.251 them all up and splitting them. 00:34:46.651 --> 00:34:51.151 It will err on the side of potentially wasting a little space on a Blu-ray in 00:34:51.151 --> 00:34:53.591 order to keep all the files just accessible on the file system. 00:34:53.731 --> 00:34:58.291 And then does sequential folder naming so you know where everything's at. 00:34:58.331 --> 00:35:00.371 And this is disc two, this is disc one. And then, like I said, 00:35:00.411 --> 00:35:04.151 it also has a SQLite database that tracks the multi-disc sets for you, 00:35:04.311 --> 00:35:05.751 which you can then search against later on. 00:35:06.471 --> 00:35:09.091 Wait, okay. So it's not splitting files or anything? 00:35:09.311 --> 00:35:11.431 No, it's just kind of looking at the map and being like, okay, 00:35:11.431 --> 00:35:16.071 I can fit this season on this disk, but a few episodes are going to have to go on this other disk. 00:35:16.151 --> 00:35:18.431 And I'll properly label that in the file system, but you know, 00:35:18.551 --> 00:35:21.111 you're going to probably waste a few gigs on this disk. 00:35:21.231 --> 00:35:24.331 But the idea being that in the future, you could just put that in, 00:35:24.451 --> 00:35:27.351 mount it, and just drag and drop the files. You don't need any particular app to restore it. 00:35:27.351 --> 00:35:30.451 And then is it like thought of differently in the app? 00:35:30.591 --> 00:35:35.411 Is that like the multi-disk thought of as a single unit when you're like listing all of your disks or? 00:35:35.991 --> 00:35:38.851 So then it knows that they're at least connected in the database. 00:35:39.111 --> 00:35:42.451 Yes, exactly. And there's two paths in the app right now. There's the single 00:35:42.451 --> 00:35:43.691 disk route, which is really simple. 00:35:43.791 --> 00:35:46.291 Then there's the multi-disk route. And then if you do the multi-disk route, 00:35:46.411 --> 00:35:49.851 then the database knows, okay, this was a multi-disk entry and just stores it that way. 00:35:50.670 --> 00:35:54.670 It's a Rust app, too, which is fun, and it's the first Rust app I've ever created. 00:35:55.170 --> 00:35:58.430 I've tried to be considerate about 00:35:58.430 --> 00:36:01.870 storage space, too, so when the job is successful, it'll clean itself up. 00:36:02.010 --> 00:36:05.690 And there's also just a menu option in the TUI to just do a cleanup because 00:36:05.690 --> 00:36:09.710 from time to time, it's going to generate temporary files to stage them for 00:36:09.710 --> 00:36:12.750 the Blu-ray because I've experimented with a couple of different ways. 00:36:14.490 --> 00:36:19.410 So I bought myself a 10-pack of Blu-rays thinking I was going to use that 10-pack to back up my data. 00:36:19.650 --> 00:36:24.110 No, no. I used that 10-pack to do test after test after test with this app. 00:36:24.230 --> 00:36:25.910 I blew through an entire 10-pack of Blu-rays. 00:36:26.290 --> 00:36:28.710 So I haven't completely tested the multi-dysfunctionality. 00:36:29.050 --> 00:36:30.570 But it does dry runs, you said. 00:36:30.850 --> 00:36:33.730 Yeah, so we'll do dry runs. But, of course, to fully test, I need to burn. 00:36:35.290 --> 00:36:38.290 Yeah, and it will do some testing to make sure everything's working. 00:36:38.330 --> 00:36:41.530 And if it looks like it won't work, it'll try to warn you. 00:36:41.610 --> 00:36:44.250 And if you have any missing dependencies because of a couple apps you have to 00:36:44.250 --> 00:36:45.730 install, it'll attempt to warn you. 00:36:46.450 --> 00:36:52.850 But, yeah, it was an interesting endeavor. And I think my end goal has been 00:36:52.850 --> 00:36:56.830 accomplished in that I could either plug the drive into my NAS, 00:36:57.370 --> 00:37:02.430 my, you know, my Odroid, or I could plug it into my workstation and I can run this in either space. 00:37:03.530 --> 00:37:06.230 And you just sort of set it and forget it. And when you go to the multi-disc 00:37:06.230 --> 00:37:09.570 mode, it'll just go through the work, and it'll pop the disc out when it's ready 00:37:09.570 --> 00:37:11.850 for the next one, tell you what to label it, you pop the next disc in, 00:37:11.890 --> 00:37:15.170 and it'll start continuing the archive. And I just write it across the disc. 00:37:15.250 --> 00:37:20.990 I got a preview of the single-disc mode, so I've been playing with that one. 00:37:21.430 --> 00:37:24.750 I have not yet tried multi-disc, because you only just put it in last night. 00:37:24.790 --> 00:37:27.670 I have no idea if it would even build on your machine. Yeah, 00:37:28.210 --> 00:37:33.810 because not only that, but there's a lot of UI updates I did too, So it's like, we'll see. 00:37:33.950 --> 00:37:36.650 But I would love some help with it because I think, you know, 00:37:36.670 --> 00:37:40.710 there's a couple of little nagly bugs, but the basic functionality is there. It's GPL2. 00:37:41.690 --> 00:37:44.810 It's really easy to pick up everything, super documented, the architecture, 00:37:45.130 --> 00:37:47.570 the commit, the development, the directory structure. 00:37:47.970 --> 00:37:52.410 Everything is there. So you could just sort of pick up and keep running with it if you would like. 00:37:53.750 --> 00:37:55.590 I saw you submitted a pull request. 00:37:55.690 --> 00:37:59.850 I did, yeah. So it turns out that you mentioned kind of what it looks like, 00:37:59.890 --> 00:38:02.830 but you have added a theming system. 00:38:04.726 --> 00:38:06.986 So I thought I'd add a new theme for you. 00:38:08.106 --> 00:38:11.286 You told me to wait for the show. A hot dog theme. 00:38:11.346 --> 00:38:12.166 Hot dog theme. 00:38:12.446 --> 00:38:12.806 Yes. 00:38:13.746 --> 00:38:16.486 Classic Windows 3.1 hot dog stand. 00:38:16.626 --> 00:38:19.766 I do like the, you know, I kind of like it. I do like it. 00:38:20.066 --> 00:38:23.426 Yeah, well, because I kind of decided to lean into the 80s retro theme, 00:38:23.546 --> 00:38:25.806 but then I thought some people might find that really obnoxious. 00:38:25.906 --> 00:38:28.806 So you can actually override it at runtime, or there's a little config file, 00:38:28.946 --> 00:38:32.166 too, where you can set the theme. That's way more obnoxious than mine. 00:38:32.166 --> 00:38:36.066 And I love it. So, well, it's serious business when you're doing your backups, 00:38:36.226 --> 00:38:39.906 right? So, like, you want it to be bright with warning and emergencies. 00:38:40.086 --> 00:38:41.906 I just got a, last night I got a warning from us. Like, hey, 00:38:41.926 --> 00:38:46.326 I made a PR, but don't look at it or merge it until the show. 00:38:48.566 --> 00:38:53.146 And also, if there is about the 80s, maybe they're, like, really big into Hulkamania. That's perfect. 00:38:53.346 --> 00:38:57.446 Oh, yeah, it does. It is the Hulk colors. You're right. I never really connected those two things. 00:38:57.746 --> 00:39:01.766 Yeah, so Blu-ray is in the 90s, right? But the optical storage is very much a retro thing. 00:39:01.766 --> 00:39:08.386 And I will full-on admit I got a little tinge of delightful nostalgia the first 00:39:08.386 --> 00:39:12.186 time I took the wrapper off the spindle, opened up the spindle, 00:39:12.226 --> 00:39:13.906 pulled the Blu-ray off, and put it in the drive. 00:39:13.906 --> 00:39:16.986 And I held it there in my hand, and I'm like, this is actually fun. 00:39:17.106 --> 00:39:18.966 You just had spindles around all the time. 00:39:19.086 --> 00:39:19.246 Yeah. 00:39:21.041 --> 00:39:23.761 It's ours it's it's kind of like the the idea of like 00:39:23.761 --> 00:39:26.801 you know the the style of these optical 00:39:26.801 --> 00:39:29.881 drives you know it's it seems antiquated but 00:39:29.881 --> 00:39:33.241 at the same time there are still massive uses 00:39:33.241 --> 00:39:36.841 for it like really good uses and if you get like the the mdisc 00:39:36.841 --> 00:39:39.761 type of stuff where they claim to have like a thousand 00:39:39.761 --> 00:39:46.721 years of longevity uh the like it is a legitimate solution for storage of data 00:39:46.721 --> 00:39:52.521 and uh Especially if it's data that you're storing for the sake of like I might 00:39:52.521 --> 00:39:58.201 – like movies or TV shows or that kind of media where you don't need access to it at all times. 00:39:58.421 --> 00:40:04.621 The solution through these kinds of disks is actually like probably even better 00:40:04.621 --> 00:40:08.241 because you're not wasting really quick access stuff. 00:40:08.421 --> 00:40:12.181 And so now I've actually thought about this like a couple years ago, 00:40:12.181 --> 00:40:16.101 and now you've convinced me that I want to actually implement this. 00:40:16.101 --> 00:40:20.001 And you know like a jewel case a little blu-ray jewel case doesn't take up a lot of room i. 00:40:20.001 --> 00:40:22.301 Was gonna ask are you gonna do that are you gonna like. 00:40:22.301 --> 00:40:25.501 Or do like a like a like you could get covers or do they. 00:40:25.501 --> 00:40:28.421 Still make those discs where you could like draw images on the top. 00:40:28.421 --> 00:40:33.081 These ones do that like with the inkjet like template thing which is so cool 00:40:33.081 --> 00:40:39.661 oh man yeah um so blue vault is available at github.com slash chris lass slash 00:40:39.661 --> 00:40:43.161 blue dash vault it is vibe coded warning i. 00:40:43.161 --> 00:40:45.481 Did I don't think you can type R in. 00:40:45.881 --> 00:40:46.701 Yes, I fixed that. 00:40:46.841 --> 00:40:47.181 Oh, great. 00:40:47.301 --> 00:40:52.381 Yeah, yeah. R or, there was like Q. I don't think it was R or Q, 00:40:52.421 --> 00:40:55.121 because they were grabbed by the UI for other. 00:40:55.121 --> 00:40:55.761 I figured it must have. 00:40:55.861 --> 00:40:58.601 Yeah. I was like, oh yeah, right, of course. You know, that's, 00:40:58.741 --> 00:41:01.361 so this has been an interesting experience for me is, 00:41:02.264 --> 00:41:06.244 What I really, and I totally if I'm wrong, Wes, but what I really got away from this, 00:41:06.464 --> 00:41:10.444 what I took away from this experience is I got the core functionality working 00:41:10.444 --> 00:41:15.584 in about 45 minutes and the UI and the edge cases and all the little things 00:41:15.584 --> 00:41:18.964 like you can't type R here is what took me six to seven hours. 00:41:19.344 --> 00:41:23.844 Yep. Which totally checks out. You get the happy path done, right? 00:41:23.924 --> 00:41:26.564 You're like, oh, okay, yes, this was, I connected the core pieces of what I 00:41:26.564 --> 00:41:28.564 needed together, got it to do it. 00:41:28.664 --> 00:41:28.784 Yeah. 00:41:28.784 --> 00:41:31.384 And then you realize that there's a whole bunch of ways that you have to, 00:41:31.384 --> 00:41:35.784 like, micro-adjust to make sure that that actually is smooth and usable by a human. 00:41:36.544 --> 00:41:40.704 I mean, six hours is still pretty fast in considering what this is, you know? 00:41:40.824 --> 00:41:43.764 Yeah, well, you know, a lot of the heavy lifting's been just tools underneath 00:41:43.764 --> 00:41:46.344 that have been around on Linux forever. So I got lucky that way, 00:41:46.404 --> 00:41:47.104 right? I'm just using it. 00:41:47.304 --> 00:41:51.044 You don't have to build something to burn the disk. You just have to make sure you assemble the files. 00:41:51.224 --> 00:41:51.904 Right. Yeah, yeah. 00:41:52.344 --> 00:41:53.824 I have some real-world questions. 00:41:54.264 --> 00:41:54.504 Okay. 00:41:54.604 --> 00:41:59.844 How long does it take you to burn a 50-gig disk? And how long does it take you to retrieve said disk? 00:42:00.484 --> 00:42:04.364 So it's slower than I remember, I'll be honest with you. I expected it to be slow. 00:42:04.544 --> 00:42:08.224 I mean, and this isn't like the fastest drive either. It's a $50 external tiny 00:42:08.224 --> 00:42:10.264 thin USB drive, so they probably have faster ones. 00:42:11.324 --> 00:42:18.144 About 30 minutes, 35 minutes to burn a full disk, but I don't really often burn a full disk. 00:42:18.984 --> 00:42:22.164 So if you're doing about a half a disk, it's about 15 minutes. 00:42:22.164 --> 00:42:27.404 And then restoring, you restore at anywhere between 2 megabytes a second to 00:42:27.404 --> 00:42:29.904 30 megabytes a second, depending on where it is on the disk, 00:42:30.024 --> 00:42:31.004 how long the disk has been reading. 00:42:31.344 --> 00:42:33.384 It's one of those things where it's, I don't know if you guys remember this, 00:42:33.424 --> 00:42:37.124 but it starts faster and then it kind of slows down over time a little bit. 00:42:38.324 --> 00:42:41.424 And that's true, you'll notice with the burn, because I do try to show as best 00:42:41.424 --> 00:42:43.144 as I can your transfer rate in the UI. 00:42:43.404 --> 00:42:46.924 And so you'll see it'll start pretty solid. And then it sort of trickles down. 00:42:48.104 --> 00:42:51.844 I guess maybe as it goes wider and wider out on the disk, perhaps is what it is. 00:42:51.844 --> 00:42:52.744 It's physics, yeah. 00:42:52.964 --> 00:42:57.144 Yeah. But going through this has been an interesting, like reconnecting with 00:42:57.144 --> 00:43:02.204 physical media, thinking about documents and media that maybe I don't even need this year. 00:43:02.544 --> 00:43:04.524 And if I can buy from Newegg. 00:43:05.444 --> 00:43:09.504 You know, at three cents a gigabyte, that's probably better than any storage I can get. 00:43:09.584 --> 00:43:15.484 And then I could take some stuff off my existing network storage and maybe squeak through the year. 00:43:17.644 --> 00:43:18.384 What are you know. 00:43:18.484 --> 00:43:19.304 What are your request? 00:43:19.744 --> 00:43:23.464 OK, yeah. Oh, God. Oh, God. Oh, God. 00:43:24.324 --> 00:43:24.664 Yeah. 00:43:24.684 --> 00:43:26.024 Have you tried it yet? Have you tried it? 00:43:26.624 --> 00:43:27.084 I'm not yet. 00:43:27.084 --> 00:43:28.544 I got to get this in your hand so you can break it. 00:43:29.144 --> 00:43:32.844 But I have past experience that makes me imagine that feature request. 00:43:32.844 --> 00:43:36.124 and are you taking audio feature requests at this time? 00:43:36.804 --> 00:43:40.864 Audio? Oh, I mean, you're submitting it via audio instead of a P. Okay, yeah, go ahead. 00:43:43.244 --> 00:43:48.504 I just wondered, since, you know, you just admitted that burning disks takes 00:43:48.504 --> 00:43:51.364 a little longer than transferring to hard drives, but that's okay, 00:43:51.524 --> 00:43:52.904 that's okay. This is long-term media. 00:43:53.204 --> 00:44:03.244 So does Blue Vault have the ability to manage multiple burn devices to do the burning? 00:44:03.744 --> 00:44:05.844 Oh, that's a great idea. 00:44:05.844 --> 00:44:08.544 You could stack up five of these or something and just let them go. 00:44:08.884 --> 00:44:12.684 Maybe like once a month you pick one up for the first three months of the year or something. 00:44:13.004 --> 00:44:13.544 Multiplex it. 00:44:14.304 --> 00:44:18.464 And then after the multi-disc, you have like five of these machines doing the 00:44:18.464 --> 00:44:19.244 burning to the multi-disc. 00:44:19.284 --> 00:44:23.084 So it's technically only to take the whole process of one. 00:44:24.511 --> 00:44:26.411 That is a fascinating idea. 00:44:26.771 --> 00:44:27.351 You're welcome. 00:44:28.731 --> 00:44:32.431 You need some serious USB bus power. Because these things, one of the things 00:44:32.431 --> 00:44:36.991 I've noticed is if you don't have a dedicated powered USB hub, 00:44:37.171 --> 00:44:38.791 your built-in port might not be enough. 00:44:39.031 --> 00:44:42.231 And so the burn will fail in Blue Vault, not because of Blue Vault, 00:44:42.311 --> 00:44:43.891 but because the disk doesn't have enough juice. 00:44:44.271 --> 00:44:47.751 So I had to plug it into an externally powered hub in order to get enough juice. 00:44:47.971 --> 00:44:48.671 So it was a laser. 00:44:49.091 --> 00:44:51.151 Three, four disks when you figured that one out? 00:44:51.171 --> 00:44:56.811 It was two disks. yeah i i ended up like getting real learning real quick some 00:44:56.811 --> 00:44:59.931 of the syntax to like just read if there's a file system at all on the disc 00:44:59.931 --> 00:45:04.311 because if there's a file system at all you can't burn to it in for bdrs at least so. 00:45:04.311 --> 00:45:10.131 So does it burn to the like the data as is or does it have like a way for let's 00:45:10.131 --> 00:45:15.191 say you're burning some kind of movie or tv show if it's like playable in a blu-ray player. 00:45:15.191 --> 00:45:19.991 No no it's only it's only meant for like being able to the the guiding principle 00:45:19.991 --> 00:45:23.171 was you could put it like on another Linux box in 10 years and just drag the files off. 00:45:23.491 --> 00:45:23.811 Gotcha. 00:45:23.891 --> 00:45:26.291 Cause I don't actually, I don't really have anything anymore. 00:45:26.531 --> 00:45:30.591 I, if you wanted to play the movie, you would be doing that and then dragging 00:45:30.591 --> 00:45:31.811 it into jellyfin anyway. 00:45:32.031 --> 00:45:32.151 Yeah. 00:45:32.791 --> 00:45:36.051 Yeah. I feel like, I feel like if you're just trying to see how, 00:45:36.231 --> 00:45:40.071 how far you're going down the optical media path, you know? 00:45:40.291 --> 00:45:42.871 Well, I started thinking of, I'm like, this is, you know, how bad would it be 00:45:42.871 --> 00:45:45.451 to just have one of these on the TV and just put, that's not that bad. 00:45:45.631 --> 00:45:46.631 You know, I started thinking about that. 00:45:47.071 --> 00:45:50.991 I think the other thing that'd be kind of a neat feature for this would be to 00:45:50.991 --> 00:45:54.271 just have it also manage archives to disk. 00:45:54.431 --> 00:45:56.891 Like if you had a bunch of like, you know, old disks sitting around, 00:45:57.011 --> 00:45:59.651 although I don't know if I would trust those as much for long-term storage, 00:45:59.811 --> 00:46:03.591 but maybe to get you through the year, because it's still nice to have it organize 00:46:03.591 --> 00:46:07.071 the file system and track in the database what disk it's on and all of that. 00:46:07.391 --> 00:46:10.691 So that's another thing I was thinking about is like a larger storage or, 00:46:10.851 --> 00:46:13.251 you know, you could go to a network mount or something like that. 00:46:14.712 --> 00:46:15.772 So the multi-disc is new. 00:46:16.652 --> 00:46:21.372 What would be interesting is if it had a way of, like, suppose it would, 00:46:21.552 --> 00:46:23.052 would it win multi-disc mode? 00:46:23.192 --> 00:46:25.852 Could you do recursively for, like, a whole folder path? 00:46:26.072 --> 00:46:26.392 Yeah. 00:46:26.852 --> 00:46:32.192 So you could, like, sort of have it, say, back up a system onto a couple of discs if you needed to. 00:46:32.252 --> 00:46:33.312 You could, yeah. I mean, it just... 00:46:33.312 --> 00:46:36.012 And then just, like, have it run and piecemeal it all back together. 00:46:36.192 --> 00:46:39.152 So when you start it, you know, you tell what mode you want to go in and you 00:46:39.152 --> 00:46:40.072 give yourself some notes. 00:46:40.072 --> 00:46:43.892 And then one of the second to final screens is there is, 00:46:43.892 --> 00:46:46.912 you can manually enter a path or there's 00:46:46.912 --> 00:46:50.192 a file browser you can tab down to and you can browse and whatever 00:46:50.192 --> 00:46:52.952 top level you capture it'll back up everything underneath that 00:46:52.952 --> 00:46:56.432 top level okay so you can do your home directory too or whatever yeah and 00:46:56.432 --> 00:46:59.452 i actually was thinking that is what i'm going to do is i'm going to do one 00:46:59.452 --> 00:47:03.112 for my paperless you know and all that and just put it on a shelf maybe once 00:47:03.112 --> 00:47:06.312 a quarter once a year something like that and if something goes wrong i'll at 00:47:06.312 --> 00:47:10.352 least have that hard copy that i can refer to um and you know if it's in a standard 00:47:10.352 --> 00:47:13.492 file system format then it'd be possible that if I want to recover that, 00:47:13.592 --> 00:47:16.592 say I want some document for some reason, God forbid, 00:47:17.332 --> 00:47:20.352 I don't need to restore all of it into paperless. Maybe I just go get that one file. 00:47:20.492 --> 00:47:20.652 Sure. 00:47:21.452 --> 00:47:25.672 That's why I like having it, even though you will sometimes have a Blu-ray where 00:47:25.672 --> 00:47:29.592 you didn't use all the space, maybe as efficiently, I think it's worth it. 00:47:29.772 --> 00:47:32.892 Yeah, I think this is a really interesting idea, and I also think it's kind 00:47:32.892 --> 00:47:37.852 of hilarious that it's vibe-coded because that means AI caused the problem and solved the problem. 00:47:38.572 --> 00:47:39.572 That's a great point. 00:47:41.332 --> 00:47:41.532 Oh, man. 00:47:45.431 --> 00:47:49.011 There is no sponsor for this segment, but we do have our great members and, 00:47:49.111 --> 00:47:49.791 of course, our boosters. 00:47:49.971 --> 00:47:53.091 So I just want to take a moment and thank them because at the beginning of the 00:47:53.091 --> 00:47:56.111 year, you know, we're sorting out the deals. It can take a little while, 00:47:56.111 --> 00:48:01.531 and there are periods that if we didn't have the support of our members, we wouldn't have a show. 00:48:02.131 --> 00:48:05.571 And so I'm very grateful. And if you haven't signed up yet, I do still have 00:48:05.571 --> 00:48:07.691 the bootleg promo code. That's a fantastic deal. 00:48:07.831 --> 00:48:11.591 It's so good I don't say the price on air. But it gets you access to Linux Unplugged's 00:48:11.591 --> 00:48:16.171 bootleg feed and the no-ads feed you get to pick, as well as the launch bootleg 00:48:16.171 --> 00:48:20.231 feed, which much like this has extra content that just doesn't make it in the main show. 00:48:20.391 --> 00:48:22.411 And there's always a little additional context in there, too. 00:48:22.571 --> 00:48:25.811 So thank you, everybody, who supports us with a boost or with membership, 00:48:25.811 --> 00:48:28.111 because right now you make the show possible. 00:48:28.171 --> 00:48:31.591 We really do appreciate it. Thank you very much. And on with the show, gentlemen. 00:48:35.291 --> 00:48:40.991 I'll see a little bag of boosts here and we're gonna start off with our baller the dude abides, 00:48:45.600 --> 00:48:51.460 Now the Dutabide sent in a row of McDucks here. 22,222 sets. 00:48:55.100 --> 00:48:58.900 Stop suggesting awesome projects. I'm running out of resources. 00:49:00.080 --> 00:49:04.420 Metalurk X seems promising. I have seen it mentioned a couple times out in the 00:49:04.420 --> 00:49:06.680 wild, but didn't bother deploying it. 00:49:06.820 --> 00:49:09.820 And now because of Linux Unplugged, I have to try it. 00:49:10.140 --> 00:49:13.320 All right, the dude. You know, I think you'd be pleasantly surprised. 00:49:13.320 --> 00:49:18.740 you could set it up and let it just run for a week and then come back to it 00:49:18.740 --> 00:49:21.560 and when you got time to tinker with it because let it run and discover. 00:49:22.680 --> 00:49:27.740 I was over the last couple of days realizing that, so I've got these stupid 00:49:27.740 --> 00:49:30.000 mesh APs. It's great, whatever. 00:49:31.340 --> 00:49:37.980 But IoT devices in particular are so dumb and they will really lock into one particular AP. 00:49:38.300 --> 00:49:42.440 The decision in a mesh AP network happens on the client side And if the client 00:49:42.440 --> 00:49:45.920 side isn't willing to move nodes, it won't. 00:49:46.020 --> 00:49:50.840 And so if the stupid IoT device that's way far away from the AP decides to connect 00:49:50.840 --> 00:49:55.000 to that AP, you basically have to take the mesh nodes offline and make things 00:49:55.000 --> 00:49:57.260 forcibly readjust mess. 00:49:57.780 --> 00:50:02.320 So I was dealing with that. And it was really interesting to watch NetAlertX kind of catch up. 00:50:02.440 --> 00:50:06.160 Oh, this has moved over here. Oh, this device has changed over here. Oh, yeah, right. 00:50:06.540 --> 00:50:10.040 Good job, NetAlertX. You nailed it. So it's worth it. And you can just let it 00:50:10.040 --> 00:50:12.620 run for a bit. and then come back around to it. 00:50:14.360 --> 00:50:20.460 Well, Adversary 17 comes in with a Spaceballs boost. That, of course, is 12,345 sats. 00:50:25.624 --> 00:50:29.544 Adversary says, I have a lot of similar ability for monitoring within my Unify 00:50:29.544 --> 00:50:33.164 dream machine, but I still might set this up. Good find, Mr. Fisher. 00:50:33.524 --> 00:50:35.524 Hey, I think what you just said also works for this. 00:50:35.844 --> 00:50:40.764 You know, yeah. I would love to hear more feedback on the Unify stuff if our 00:50:40.764 --> 00:50:42.484 audience likes the Unify stuff. 00:50:42.804 --> 00:50:45.584 I don't know how much it can pull in, but it did seem like they had a plug-in 00:50:45.584 --> 00:50:49.124 that could also, like if you ended up wanting the Unify data in NetAlert. 00:50:49.544 --> 00:50:50.664 Peanut butter and jelly, West Payne. 00:50:50.864 --> 00:50:56.004 Mm-hmm. Ooh, our buddy, our pal Gene Bean comes in with the RoboDucks. 00:50:57.984 --> 00:51:02.784 In response to Olympia Mike and the Nixbook project and the licensing question, 00:51:02.964 --> 00:51:04.784 Gene makes a great point, which we should have mentioned. 00:51:05.264 --> 00:51:09.424 Keep in mind that if you have contributors and don't also use a CLA or contributor 00:51:09.424 --> 00:51:13.784 license agreement from day one, you can't change the license of the existing 00:51:13.784 --> 00:51:16.744 code later without sign-off from all prior contributors. 00:51:17.004 --> 00:51:20.784 Gene Bean saying go for the CLA? Something to think about. He's right. 00:51:20.784 --> 00:51:24.144 And it's also just worthwhile, you know, thinking about the licensing kind of 00:51:24.144 --> 00:51:25.784 early on and up front is worthwhile. 00:51:26.604 --> 00:51:28.484 Yeah, I agree. It is definitely a good point. Thank you, Gene. 00:51:29.044 --> 00:51:31.844 Yeah, and not having a license. And some people don't, like, 00:51:31.864 --> 00:51:36.464 create a project and don't put a license at all. And that just causes massive craziness. 00:51:36.664 --> 00:51:39.344 That's, I think, kind of where he's at. He's getting popular enough now where 00:51:39.344 --> 00:51:42.504 it's like people are asking rather consistently, what's the license here? 00:51:42.784 --> 00:51:43.784 So they know how to proceed. 00:51:44.824 --> 00:51:46.204 So, Mike, let us know what you end up doing. 00:51:46.744 --> 00:51:51.924 Well, Odyssey, Westra boosted in a couple boosts here for a total of 6,000. 206 Satoshis. 00:51:55.044 --> 00:51:57.324 It turns out they all say Happy New Year. 00:51:57.644 --> 00:51:58.644 Happy New Year! 00:51:58.904 --> 00:51:59.424 Happy New Year! 00:51:59.484 --> 00:52:00.124 Happy New Year! 00:52:01.044 --> 00:52:02.424 The year of the Linux desktop. 00:52:02.604 --> 00:52:08.924 Thank you, Odyssey. Nice to hear from you. Pegdots here with 6,666 sats. 00:52:11.687 --> 00:52:14.307 Well, I'm guessing that Brent doesn't work for Nextcloud anymore. 00:52:14.307 --> 00:52:17.487 So what's he doing now? Is he a traveling salesman in his bang bus? 00:52:17.707 --> 00:52:22.227 As a JB member, I'd be interested to know how much financial value added is 00:52:22.227 --> 00:52:25.327 compared to the boost in streaming. Oh, these are – okay. So we've got two questions here, three questions. 00:52:25.467 --> 00:52:28.047 I know that the functions like Bitcoin value fluctuate. 00:52:28.567 --> 00:52:31.727 Difficult to put in numbers but interested in a rough idea. So think of it – 00:52:31.727 --> 00:52:33.227 okay. So I'll answer that one first. 00:52:33.447 --> 00:52:36.827 So this week where we have – And I think what. 00:52:36.827 --> 00:52:40.787 The question was, how does boosting and streaming compare to memberships in 00:52:40.787 --> 00:52:42.587 terms of supporting the show or something like that? 00:52:42.867 --> 00:52:46.107 Yeah, I think on average, there's still we still probably get significantly 00:52:46.107 --> 00:52:48.527 more support through the membership mechanism on average. 00:52:49.007 --> 00:52:52.267 And so the way we can that and the thing about that is that's we look at as, 00:52:52.327 --> 00:52:53.767 OK, that's the revenue we can plan on. 00:52:54.107 --> 00:52:55.227 Kind of a consistent baseline. 00:52:55.607 --> 00:52:59.007 And then the boost is like, OK, that's like when, you know, you get a bonus, 00:52:59.107 --> 00:53:01.907 you did a lot, you did good, you did. And that's like the extra stuff that goes 00:53:01.907 --> 00:53:05.407 directly to all of us because the show through the memberships is, 00:53:05.487 --> 00:53:06.687 you know, it's barely paying the bills. 00:53:07.027 --> 00:53:10.027 And so it's not really equivalent. 00:53:10.227 --> 00:53:12.587 One sort of serves one function and one serves. And we're very, 00:53:12.727 --> 00:53:16.147 very lucky it worked out that way because really since COVID, 00:53:16.527 --> 00:53:17.827 the ad market has just been destroyed. 00:53:17.827 --> 00:53:20.727 But really in the last few years, it's perhaps turning around, 00:53:20.907 --> 00:53:22.007 but it's still very slow. 00:53:22.007 --> 00:53:27.187 And one thing that I think is very true is as the podcast market has grown, 00:53:27.467 --> 00:53:31.527 the sponsors are looking at different types of shows and different demographics 00:53:31.527 --> 00:53:34.367 than they were a few years ago when we were sort of in our heyday of, 00:53:34.447 --> 00:53:35.647 you know, every spot was sold out. 00:53:36.387 --> 00:53:42.547 And it's just how it goes is, you know, a podcast today is just a much different beast. 00:53:42.707 --> 00:53:44.907 Usually has a celebrity name attached to it if it's very successful. 00:53:45.167 --> 00:53:48.227 Yeah. The ecosystem around it has changed. The ecosystem within has changed. 00:53:48.327 --> 00:53:48.427 Yeah. 00:53:48.747 --> 00:53:51.247 Who people and what they're marketing towards has changed. 00:53:51.247 --> 00:53:56.067 Yeah. And so for us, it's like the two things are very symbiotic and used differently. 00:53:56.387 --> 00:53:59.367 We really do appreciate both the support. And I know it's, you know, 00:53:59.447 --> 00:54:03.127 it's the thing is, it's like, it's like I've kind of made the equivalent seat with Linux magazines. 00:54:03.267 --> 00:54:05.467 It's like, it's a very niche thing. There's a core audience that loves it. 00:54:06.688 --> 00:54:11.728 The fundamental economic model might not actually be viable with the direct 00:54:11.728 --> 00:54:14.528 commercial market because the 00:54:14.528 --> 00:54:18.108 scale of advertising on the internet now requires essentially millions. 00:54:18.308 --> 00:54:22.948 And so it's where these kinds of direct audience supported things really make 00:54:22.948 --> 00:54:26.988 a difference because it's then made possible by the very niche that's interested in it. 00:54:27.068 --> 00:54:30.008 And I don't think like the Linux magazines could have survived without something. 00:54:30.088 --> 00:54:31.208 They didn't have anything like that. 00:54:31.488 --> 00:54:34.128 And so, you know, they went the way of the dinosaur for the most part. 00:54:34.408 --> 00:54:38.068 Good question. Oh, and then, Brentley, do you have any comment on the NextCloud stuff? 00:54:39.008 --> 00:54:42.648 Besides being a full-time JBer, I'm sure you do other things as well. 00:54:43.708 --> 00:54:46.588 Yeah, I would say good guess on the NextCloud part. I haven't been a NextClouder 00:54:46.588 --> 00:54:49.928 since about, I don't know, May of last year and have been basically, 00:54:49.928 --> 00:54:52.448 what would you call it, Chris, vagabonding 00:54:52.448 --> 00:54:55.288 since then, doing a bunch of JB projects there for a long time. 00:54:55.348 --> 00:54:58.528 We rescued, I don't know if you heard about it, rescued this crazy van that's 00:54:58.528 --> 00:55:01.348 still giving me projects on a daily basis, it seems. 00:55:01.348 --> 00:55:02.488 Yeah, you're kind of restoring that. 00:55:02.488 --> 00:55:04.308 You know something else we don't talk about with you, Brent, 00:55:04.448 --> 00:55:07.628 too, is you are a very handy guy, Brent. 00:55:08.148 --> 00:55:10.888 Like, if Brent needs to work for a couple of days, you know, 00:55:10.948 --> 00:55:13.688 there's friends and family that have projects where they need somebody who can 00:55:13.688 --> 00:55:15.768 go on site and do a lot of really good work with their hands, 00:55:15.868 --> 00:55:16.568 like good, intricate work. 00:55:17.517 --> 00:55:20.537 masonry type work i don't know is that what it's called what is it called that kind of work. 00:55:20.537 --> 00:55:24.237 Uh like i don't know general construction work i'm kind of a generalist i would 00:55:24.237 --> 00:55:29.117 say but you're a fancy experience and i have high standards that most people 00:55:29.117 --> 00:55:32.017 don't have i guess right yeah i. 00:55:32.017 --> 00:55:33.257 Think that's the word i was looking for. 00:55:33.257 --> 00:55:37.957 Basically just yesterday i was doing that like uh i had an uncle near here who 00:55:37.957 --> 00:55:41.337 was like hey i need some electrical work done but i don't know what i'm doing 00:55:41.337 --> 00:55:44.817 and last time i did it i really screwed it up so can you come over and fix all 00:55:44.817 --> 00:55:47.677 my mistakes that i've done for the last decade, and so we did that. 00:55:47.737 --> 00:55:48.757 And it worked out really well. 00:55:48.757 --> 00:55:50.117 And then that was when you come over to my place. 00:55:50.277 --> 00:55:53.997 The other thing you have to know is Brent has a hard time saying no to those kind of requests. 00:55:54.017 --> 00:55:54.857 That's true, too. Yeah. 00:55:55.137 --> 00:55:56.997 Because he's a kind and generous person. 00:55:57.517 --> 00:56:03.457 Basically, I've been chasing, like, hanging out with people I love and chasing 00:56:03.457 --> 00:56:05.977 happiness instead of financial stuff. 00:56:06.417 --> 00:56:10.537 That leaves, you know, my bank account sad, but my soul quite happy. 00:56:11.097 --> 00:56:15.157 He's saying hanging out with people he loves, but he's on the opposite coast. I don't understand. 00:56:15.157 --> 00:56:17.417 Sharing my time with people I love. 00:56:17.817 --> 00:56:22.537 Message received on that one. All right. All right. Wes, you want to take Mr. Facial Hair? 00:56:22.537 --> 00:56:25.837 Yes. The facial hair comes in with 6,000 sats. 00:56:27.210 --> 00:56:31.030 I wanted to shine some light on an area where open source and Linux are doing 00:56:31.030 --> 00:56:33.790 quite well. And it's tabletop gaming. 00:56:34.110 --> 00:56:34.270 Really? 00:56:34.410 --> 00:56:37.590 For example, the D&D game I run uses Nextcloud for content hosting, 00:56:38.030 --> 00:56:42.630 Foundry VTT for our virtual table, and self-hosted Jitsi for player comms. 00:56:42.890 --> 00:56:46.510 Just wanted to get your thoughts on this and see if you all had any fun D&D stories. 00:56:47.110 --> 00:56:51.630 Facial hair, why do you suppose this is? What has attributed this phenomenon? 00:56:51.890 --> 00:56:53.090 And how can we replicate it? 00:56:53.650 --> 00:56:54.950 Thank you for the report. 00:56:55.070 --> 00:56:55.510 That's great. 00:56:55.510 --> 00:57:00.030 I mean, there's a lot of great tools, and you need to accomplish a certain set 00:57:00.030 --> 00:57:02.730 of things to have a good game going. Why not solve them with open source? 00:57:02.950 --> 00:57:04.030 You ever play any D&D? 00:57:04.170 --> 00:57:07.530 Yeah, I like D&D. It's been a while, but I've played many. 00:57:07.710 --> 00:57:12.350 I mean, never super consistent, but I've had many fun D&D experiences over the years. 00:57:12.450 --> 00:57:13.450 Michael, you ever do any D&D? 00:57:13.730 --> 00:57:15.250 I've never played D&D. No. 00:57:15.750 --> 00:57:16.610 Brent, what about you? 00:57:16.790 --> 00:57:21.210 I have never participated. However, I have watched a lot of famous people play 00:57:21.210 --> 00:57:25.590 in the last couple months. and have been invited several times, 00:57:25.630 --> 00:57:29.930 but I feel unprepared, let's say. Daunted. 00:57:30.490 --> 00:57:33.390 Well, I mean, I hope they're not inviting you to be the DM. 00:57:33.850 --> 00:57:38.790 No, no, no, by far not. However, I still feel a way out of my league. 00:57:39.319 --> 00:57:43.539 I feel like this is an opportunity that we could do a collab of like doing like, 00:57:43.539 --> 00:57:46.539 you know, first timers doing D&D. 00:57:46.839 --> 00:57:50.359 Like pair up first timer with a pro or something. I want to learn enough where 00:57:50.359 --> 00:57:53.059 I could just do like commentary on the streams like, oh, he moves over here 00:57:53.059 --> 00:57:54.639 and does this. You know, I don't know. 00:57:54.779 --> 00:57:57.739 I don't know if it's more golf or if it's more wrestling for D&D, but. 00:57:59.179 --> 00:58:01.239 I think it's more. I think it's more golf, maybe. 00:58:01.919 --> 00:58:02.399 Yeah, I think so. 00:58:02.719 --> 00:58:05.519 They have their own dialogue, so you don't want to interact too much. 00:58:05.519 --> 00:58:10.879 but there's actually a few like i haven't done like play dnd but i've seen like 00:58:10.879 --> 00:58:15.819 random videos of people playing dnd because there's a couple uh shows that are 00:58:15.819 --> 00:58:20.619 on youtube where it's just like a bunch of comedians playing dnd and that's 00:58:20.619 --> 00:58:21.939 that's entertaining stuff yeah for sure. 00:58:21.939 --> 00:58:24.639 What's fun too right is they have like all kinds of different types of 00:58:24.639 --> 00:58:27.639 games at this point so one of the first ones i did was actually a star wars themed 00:58:27.639 --> 00:58:30.439 one that a roommate ran and uh it's kind of a new roommate 00:58:30.439 --> 00:58:35.019 and i i came home and another uh roommate was working at a donut shop and so 00:58:35.019 --> 00:58:38.719 they had all these like you know like end of the day donuts like they'd pushed 00:58:38.719 --> 00:58:42.099 um some of the like taking a table out of a room and pushed it in with the main 00:58:42.099 --> 00:58:47.139 kitchen table and the center was filled with donuts and i was like coming home 00:58:47.139 --> 00:58:48.659 and i was like what is happening. 00:58:48.659 --> 00:58:49.599 That sounds like an awesome. 00:58:49.599 --> 00:58:51.559 Introduction it was a great introduction not bad. 00:58:51.559 --> 00:58:57.959 At all i i would say if we want to do a jb dnd at some point maybe a fun stream 00:58:57.959 --> 00:59:00.779 on the holidays or when we're all feeling like we don't have too much work, 00:59:00.979 --> 00:59:03.779 probably our buddy Jason would host that for us. 00:59:03.839 --> 00:59:04.739 That would be great. 00:59:04.819 --> 00:59:09.639 He is a professional D&D-er, so he would organize that for us if we wanted. 00:59:10.279 --> 00:59:11.079 Why am I not surprised? 00:59:11.079 --> 00:59:12.319 And he's listening right now, so hey, Jason. 00:59:12.679 --> 00:59:15.979 Hello, Jason! Alright, thank you everybody who supported the show, 00:59:16.059 --> 00:59:17.359 the members and the boosters. 00:59:20.219 --> 00:59:23.599 When you look at our SAT streamers, 22 of you stream SATs as you listen, 00:59:23.659 --> 00:59:26.919 you collectively stacked 25,340 SATs. 00:59:27.019 --> 00:59:33.059 When you combine that with our boosters, it's a humble but appreciated 85,267 sats. 00:59:36.887 --> 00:59:42.747 This can be a thing from time to time because the last two episodes, the sun was shining. 00:59:43.287 --> 00:59:44.827 Crazy. We got sunburned. 00:59:45.027 --> 00:59:47.847 Yeah. We still have our skin peeling. 00:59:48.107 --> 00:59:52.007 You guys really blew us away. What does tend to happen is we kind of go into 00:59:52.007 --> 00:59:53.827 famine. We sort of feast and then we have famine for a bit. 00:59:53.827 --> 00:59:54.327 Like a rain shadow. 00:59:54.447 --> 00:59:57.987 Yeah. So if you've been waiting to support the show, now it could be a good 00:59:57.987 --> 00:59:59.827 time during the famine. We really do appreciate it. 01:00:00.047 --> 01:00:02.887 It's really easy to boost to something like Fountain FM. In fact, 01:00:02.947 --> 01:00:03.867 they're making it easier and 01:00:03.867 --> 01:00:06.887 easier, guys. It's getting crazy what they're doing with the new features. 01:00:07.127 --> 01:00:10.507 There's a whole self-hosted platform out there with things like AlbiHub and 01:00:10.507 --> 01:00:13.027 lots of good apps at podcastapps.com. 01:00:13.147 --> 01:00:16.527 Then you get additional features like transcripts. You get the cloud chapters. 01:00:16.707 --> 01:00:19.827 You get notifications within 90 seconds when a new episode is out. 01:00:20.247 --> 01:00:23.567 Additionally, there's all kinds of new things coming all the time like live 01:00:23.567 --> 01:00:27.067 stream support and more. So check it out at podcastapps.com. 01:00:37.927 --> 01:00:42.487 All right, now, the first pick this week, I think, Brenly, you spotted this 01:00:42.487 --> 01:00:44.227 one, and for a good reason, right? 01:00:44.347 --> 01:00:48.187 This was Copia, I think is maybe how you say it, a cross-platform backup tool 01:00:48.187 --> 01:00:52.147 for the various operating systems out there with some really nice features. 01:00:52.467 --> 01:00:56.487 Yeah, I've been diving into Copia. It was mentioned a couple times by some of 01:00:56.487 --> 01:01:02.127 our listeners as a response to our, you know, several scattered backup episodes 01:01:02.127 --> 01:01:03.247 that we've done in the past. 01:01:03.247 --> 01:01:04.827 And you could consider this one of them. 01:01:05.387 --> 01:01:09.267 Yeah. Here's your mini segment for, you know, give us some feedback on what we're doing wrong. 01:01:09.767 --> 01:01:15.447 But I had a friend who ran into a situation where their laptop was stolen out 01:01:15.447 --> 01:01:18.907 of their apartment while they were there sleeping just overnight. 01:01:19.287 --> 01:01:23.667 And it turns out that person also had a thesis that was due in a week. 01:01:23.667 --> 01:01:27.807 And that was their only copy of pretty much all of the stuff they've created 01:01:27.807 --> 01:01:28.927 in the last couple years. 01:01:29.629 --> 01:01:34.129 So somehow as a crazy story, I won't tell here, they got it back like a random 01:01:34.129 --> 01:01:36.489 stranger came and gave the laptop back. 01:01:36.729 --> 01:01:40.509 I don't know really the whole story there. But anyway, so that situation got much better. 01:01:40.649 --> 01:01:46.149 But it got me thinking, well, I think my duty in this world is to help my friends with their backups. 01:01:46.369 --> 01:01:49.909 And I've been trying to do that for more than a decade. 01:01:50.289 --> 01:01:53.689 But it sounds like there's something to do here. 01:01:53.829 --> 01:01:58.229 So I wanted to set up a backup system for her that just kind of ran in the background. 01:01:58.229 --> 01:02:00.969 she never ever ever had to think about and if 01:02:00.969 --> 01:02:03.749 this kind of situation happened i can just kind of step in and 01:02:03.749 --> 01:02:06.609 help out and copia's sort of fit 01:02:06.609 --> 01:02:09.669 the bill on this one because usually i would reach for a linux only tool 01:02:09.669 --> 01:02:12.589 because i only do support for friends who run linux 01:02:12.589 --> 01:02:15.389 but she was because her laptop 01:02:15.389 --> 01:02:18.209 was stolen given a laptop by her parents which is a windows 01:02:18.209 --> 01:02:21.329 laptop and she was like i might just use it as is so i 01:02:21.329 --> 01:02:25.089 figured okay i need something that's you know cross-platform and 01:02:25.089 --> 01:02:28.969 copia seemed to fit the bill there because the interface is just 01:02:28.969 --> 01:02:32.089 the same on a bunch of different platforms the you 01:02:32.089 --> 01:02:35.109 know three ones we care about and it 01:02:35.109 --> 01:02:37.909 also is serverless which means you know it could just kind of 01:02:37.909 --> 01:02:42.229 run on its own on a laptop which is all that this friend in particular and many 01:02:42.229 --> 01:02:47.169 other friends i can think of and family members have so i kind of started diving 01:02:47.169 --> 01:02:53.089 into copia as maybe the next way i can help a bunch of people and if i can just 01:02:53.089 --> 01:02:55.949 suggest one tool for all of them, that would make my life easier. 01:02:56.209 --> 01:03:00.349 So the things I loved about Copia is cross-platform, as I mentioned. 01:03:00.509 --> 01:03:04.469 It seems really quite modern. It's written in Go, which is nice and fast. 01:03:05.069 --> 01:03:08.449 But also there's a lot of people who've been contributing to it. 01:03:08.549 --> 01:03:12.289 I think I saw 170 contributors, which is something I always care about. 01:03:12.769 --> 01:03:15.989 But there's some cool stuff here. So it can back up to, you know, 01:03:16.349 --> 01:03:20.589 Amazon S3 and Backblaze and those kind of things by default. Yeah. 01:03:21.902 --> 01:03:24.802 one thing i thought our little crew here would really love is 01:03:24.802 --> 01:03:27.882 it can also if you have r clone installed it 01:03:27.882 --> 01:03:30.942 can also control our clone as sort 01:03:30.942 --> 01:03:34.582 of an interface to our clone and support a 01:03:34.582 --> 01:03:40.082 lot of what our clone can do as a back end so the options for back ends is plenty 01:03:40.082 --> 01:03:44.182 and i think you'd be hard pressed to find a back end that doesn't work for you 01:03:44.182 --> 01:03:49.222 and it just runs really well the other The thing I liked is the interface is 01:03:49.222 --> 01:03:51.482 super configurable if you want it to be, 01:03:51.682 --> 01:03:53.962 but it can also be fairly straightforward. 01:03:53.982 --> 01:03:57.762 So it's a nice blend for someone who's not that tech savvy who has it running, 01:03:57.942 --> 01:04:00.922 but then I can just pop in and make some adjustments whenever I need to. 01:04:01.282 --> 01:04:05.122 That sounds like a low-key compliment, but this is the QA guy over here, right? 01:04:05.202 --> 01:04:10.562 So that means the interface wasn't riddled with a bunch of obvious bugs or defects or silly things. 01:04:10.702 --> 01:04:12.222 Well, I found one or two, but they weren't critical. 01:04:12.482 --> 01:04:15.962 So we'll get it. Of course. Of course. 01:04:17.202 --> 01:04:21.002 But I would say give it a try. I've been using Borg for myself for the last 01:04:21.002 --> 01:04:24.882 couple of years, and this actually is getting me to start thinking if I should 01:04:24.882 --> 01:04:26.602 switch to it permanently for my own stuff, too. 01:04:27.182 --> 01:04:30.902 So not only does it have support for a lot of the cloud storage providers we've 01:04:30.902 --> 01:04:35.362 all heard of, but then, as you might expect, it also has support for any WebDAV 01:04:35.362 --> 01:04:39.402 or SFTP or like Brent said, our clone support, too, which really opens it up. 01:04:39.402 --> 01:04:45.082 So that's pretty nice because, you know, you could have one person you're helping 01:04:45.082 --> 01:04:48.922 that uses their Dropbox and another person you're helping uses their Google Cloud storage. 01:04:49.062 --> 01:04:51.782 But it's the same interface and options sitting on top of that. 01:04:51.862 --> 01:04:52.982 You don't have to keep learning new tools. 01:04:53.162 --> 01:04:58.302 Yeah. It's Apache 2 is the license on that. And, yes, it does save everything 01:04:58.302 --> 01:04:59.642 encrypted locally. Yeah. 01:05:00.385 --> 01:05:03.585 before it sends them up to the cloud provider. Nice one, Brent. 01:05:03.825 --> 01:05:06.685 Good find. Sorry to hear about that story with the laptop. That's awful. 01:05:07.245 --> 01:05:09.485 Yeah, and it's really a thanks to the audience for suggesting this one. 01:05:09.585 --> 01:05:12.165 I had it noted for future reference, and the future is now. 01:05:12.565 --> 01:05:17.165 Ah, isn't it funny? Later becomes now. Well, since I was talking, 01:05:17.165 --> 01:05:21.385 you know, Blu-rays and whatnot, you could also just go a little simpler with 01:05:21.385 --> 01:05:22.785 something called Power ISO. 01:05:23.105 --> 01:05:25.705 It's not a free software app, but it is available for Linux, 01:05:26.225 --> 01:05:29.825 and you can probably guess what this does. It's an application for burning your 01:05:29.825 --> 01:05:33.245 disks and making your file systems and all of that, creating virtual drives 01:05:33.245 --> 01:05:34.845 or bootable disks or whatever you want. 01:05:35.265 --> 01:05:39.065 I think people even use it somehow to make Windows USB boot disks. 01:05:39.145 --> 01:05:40.065 I couldn't speak to that. 01:05:40.305 --> 01:05:44.145 But it's an application that very much invokes a 90s design. 01:05:44.145 --> 01:05:49.705 In fact, the screenshot is from a Vista era, a Windows desktop. 01:05:49.965 --> 01:05:53.065 So that's how you know it's good, right? Because if you're dealing with something 01:05:53.065 --> 01:05:56.605 that burns disks, you want to have a retro look. That's why I went with an 80s 01:05:56.605 --> 01:06:01.405 Tui, and they have a very 90s or maybe early aughts Vista theme. 01:06:01.465 --> 01:06:05.325 But they just released a new version on October 24th, 2025, so the project is 01:06:05.325 --> 01:06:07.685 still very active and is free. 01:06:09.009 --> 01:06:13.909 and works tried it out so this is you know more akin to like the typical uh 01:06:13.909 --> 01:06:15.989 things you might have back in the day to burn your disk and stuff. 01:06:15.989 --> 01:06:19.929 Well i think i have a pick from the chat room they suggested a project chris 01:06:19.929 --> 01:06:25.149 when you were talking about your blue vault yeah that is this teleco project 01:06:25.149 --> 01:06:30.329 oh teleco yeah it looks like it does a bunch of like well i don't quite know 01:06:30.329 --> 01:06:32.569 does anybody else know it better than i do because i'm just gonna wing it. 01:06:32.569 --> 01:06:36.069 Teleco is a kde project yeah and it's 01:06:36.069 --> 01:06:39.369 uh it's basically like it's more of an inventory system it's 01:06:39.369 --> 01:06:42.389 not really like a day it's not really a database tracking thing 01:06:42.389 --> 01:06:45.569 but and let's it's like a manual inserting of like keeping track 01:06:45.569 --> 01:06:51.229 of basically anything you want some information about uh so you could you know 01:06:51.229 --> 01:06:55.389 use it to track your documents but also in a sense of like labeling everything 01:06:55.389 --> 01:06:59.789 or you know your music could be associated your books could be associated like 01:06:59.789 --> 01:07:03.269 all sorts of stuff it's more of a just a overall, 01:07:03.989 --> 01:07:08.849 collections of anything so like if you have a you know digital comic books or 01:07:08.849 --> 01:07:11.809 something you could use it as a keeping track of that sort of stuff but it's 01:07:11.809 --> 01:07:13.589 more of a manual setup yeah. 01:07:13.589 --> 01:07:17.489 I did seriously consider it i have it like installed on all my machines and 01:07:17.489 --> 01:07:19.709 i was playing really yeah yeah nice. 01:07:20.369 --> 01:07:21.889 So thanks to swami for that one. 01:07:21.889 --> 01:07:23.329 But i i got kind of, 01:07:24.260 --> 01:07:26.600 burned out on the manual part of it so. 01:07:26.600 --> 01:07:30.040 Yeah it's worth checking out though people are interested so i'll toss a link 01:07:30.040 --> 01:07:33.760 to that in the show notes too but wes that wasn't what you had up your sleeve was it. 01:07:33.760 --> 01:07:39.120 It was not no so um okay well you were getting getting the coding done or the 01:07:39.120 --> 01:07:42.600 vibing done whichever it was yeah um i was trying to test it right and so i 01:07:42.600 --> 01:07:45.720 was getting it to build checking it did build on my machine i wanted to try 01:07:45.720 --> 01:07:48.920 it there was a few things we had to fix in particular some tests i'm. 01:07:48.920 --> 01:07:50.540 Betting you probably didn't have a stash of blu-rays. 01:07:51.040 --> 01:07:55.920 No. And I was using this laptop, and it doesn't even have an optical drive. 01:07:56.060 --> 01:07:56.220 No. 01:07:56.940 --> 01:07:59.900 So I go, I finally get it built, and I go and run it, and the first thing it 01:07:59.900 --> 01:08:02.880 does is say, hey, buddy, you don't have an optical drive. I'm not doing anything. 01:08:03.140 --> 01:08:09.540 Yeah. After you had a problem with that, by the way, it inspired me to add drive detection now. 01:08:09.880 --> 01:08:14.320 So it accommodates all kinds of different systems with different drive setups. 01:08:14.440 --> 01:08:14.840 Oh, nice. 01:08:14.880 --> 01:08:16.480 So you did inspire a new feature. 01:08:16.560 --> 01:08:19.560 Okay, good. And so I was like, okay, well, I could always spin up a virtual 01:08:19.560 --> 01:08:22.220 machine. That'd be pretty easy. But I was just curious, like, 01:08:22.300 --> 01:08:24.540 well, how hard is it to just emulate one of these, right? 01:08:24.660 --> 01:08:25.080 Yeah, I should have thought of this. 01:08:25.080 --> 01:08:28.320 And so I found CDEMU. CDEMU. 01:08:28.480 --> 01:08:33.000 Well, and it looks like as recent as of July 8th, 2018, version 3.2 is out. 01:08:33.060 --> 01:08:35.640 Yeah, it has a website that's appropriately old looking, though, 01:08:35.740 --> 01:08:36.700 right? I think you'll see. 01:08:37.040 --> 01:08:38.620 It definitely fits the 90s vibe. 01:08:38.680 --> 01:08:39.040 So it's retro, yeah. 01:08:39.040 --> 01:08:42.960 What is with all these different tools having such a retro thing? 01:08:42.980 --> 01:08:44.600 I don't know. I leaned into it, too. I like it. 01:08:44.600 --> 01:08:48.720 And I mean, it's like a super simple little UI. They have a GUI for it. 01:08:48.720 --> 01:08:51.140 So you run a daemon that does the emulation. 01:08:51.320 --> 01:08:51.920 Right? Is it a TUI? 01:08:52.720 --> 01:08:53.100 No. 01:08:53.500 --> 01:08:53.820 Oh. 01:08:54.140 --> 01:08:56.400 Oh, there is a CLI app that's a client for it. 01:08:56.400 --> 01:08:57.760 The disappointment in your voice. 01:08:57.940 --> 01:08:59.780 But they have, like, a nice little, like... 01:09:01.121 --> 01:09:02.241 Oh, an actual GUI? 01:09:02.321 --> 01:09:02.461 Yeah. 01:09:02.541 --> 01:09:03.201 Like a real GUI? 01:09:03.241 --> 01:09:03.801 Like a real GUI. 01:09:04.061 --> 01:09:09.021 Oh. Wow. That's fancy. That is really fancy. It actually looks GTK, perhaps? 01:09:09.121 --> 01:09:10.921 Yeah. I would suspect so. 01:09:10.961 --> 01:09:11.361 Yeah, okay. 01:09:11.481 --> 01:09:14.181 But what's cool is it's open source. 01:09:14.361 --> 01:09:15.441 Yeah, that is cool. 01:09:16.541 --> 01:09:17.141 Of course. 01:09:17.321 --> 01:09:17.441 Yeah. 01:09:17.941 --> 01:09:18.901 No, but you can... 01:09:18.901 --> 01:09:20.901 And it still works, even though it hasn't had an update in a while, 01:09:21.021 --> 01:09:24.381 right? Obviously. Oh, no, actually, some of this stuff on GitHub has been updated 01:09:24.381 --> 01:09:25.941 a little more recently, at least. 01:09:26.601 --> 01:09:32.401 GPL 2. So it does both sides. So not only can you load in ISOs and it looks 01:09:32.401 --> 01:09:33.981 like you have a CD in there, right? 01:09:34.061 --> 01:09:34.501 Yeah, it's nice. 01:09:34.601 --> 01:09:40.421 And like even it'll just present an empty one, but you can create blanks and it shows up as writable. 01:09:40.761 --> 01:09:45.381 So I was able to test your program end to end without having to drive at all. 01:09:45.461 --> 01:09:47.461 Meanwhile, I'm over here buying 10 packs. 01:09:47.461 --> 01:09:51.461 And then it leaves an ISO file on the file system that I could then mount and 01:09:51.461 --> 01:09:52.661 check that it got all the files. 01:09:52.721 --> 01:09:56.901 You could have told a guy this, I don't know, the other day before I bought 01:09:56.901 --> 01:09:58.421 another pack of Blu-rays for more testing. 01:09:58.421 --> 01:10:03.161 So you should see if you can get the LLM to make us some NixOS integration tests. 01:10:03.401 --> 01:10:03.501 Right? 01:10:03.581 --> 01:10:05.381 Run the full thing and try to burn... 01:10:06.956 --> 01:10:08.876 Because there's a Nix OS service for it. 01:10:09.276 --> 01:10:12.936 You do need to have the full testing for the disks. Yeah. 01:10:13.156 --> 01:10:15.856 So it's like, I mean, it is sort of save a little bit of time, 01:10:15.956 --> 01:10:18.236 but you still need to burn and waste anyway. 01:10:18.656 --> 01:10:21.936 What hurts the most is like when it starts to burn and fails almost immediately, 01:10:21.956 --> 01:10:25.956 and I get like one stripe, and then you can never use the disk again. 01:10:26.576 --> 01:10:30.456 And I've used like 400 kilobytes of 50 gigs, and I'm like, you've got to be kidding. 01:10:30.776 --> 01:10:34.376 Have you looked at the price in terms of like gigabytes to, you know, 01:10:34.456 --> 01:10:37.516 like the disks, or like rewritable Blu-rays? 01:10:37.896 --> 01:10:40.816 Yeah, that's a good idea. I was thinking much like, you know, 01:10:40.876 --> 01:10:43.936 cold storage, but rewritable would be handy, too. 01:10:44.796 --> 01:10:52.196 Well, this is pretty neat. C-D-E-M-U. And it is at cdemu.org, 01:10:52.216 --> 01:10:55.216 or we'll put a link in the show notes. I'm going to look at this, Wes, after the show. 01:10:56.016 --> 01:10:58.956 I wish you would have told me about it earlier, but I'm glad to know about it now. 01:11:00.096 --> 01:11:05.556 I can't believe that. It's so stupid, too. I guess, you know, learn. 01:11:06.156 --> 01:11:08.936 It's what it really comes down to, of course, is there's just a lot of little 01:11:08.936 --> 01:11:10.496 parameters you've got to pass the burn command. 01:11:11.276 --> 01:11:13.796 And as you said, right, it kind of attunes you more to doing, 01:11:13.796 --> 01:11:15.056 like, test-driven development. 01:11:15.536 --> 01:11:19.736 Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was one of the things I was telling Wes is as I started 01:11:19.736 --> 01:11:21.856 doing this, I'm like, well, I better just figure out a way to test this because 01:11:21.856 --> 01:11:25.076 I can't every time I need to run through this thing burn a disk. 01:11:25.176 --> 01:11:27.936 So I had to create a bunch of little unit tests for individual functionality 01:11:27.936 --> 01:11:30.736 so that I could test everything I could before I actually had to burn. 01:11:31.696 --> 01:11:37.876 I feel like this also um perfectly describes your different approaches to solving 01:11:37.876 --> 01:11:43.916 a problem this would always be the west approach and yeah well chris physical media right. 01:11:45.150 --> 01:11:47.870 Well, if anybody wants to take a look at it, you should be able to just pick 01:11:47.870 --> 01:11:49.290 right up and get working with it. 01:11:49.570 --> 01:11:53.330 I'd love somebody to help me with some of the basic features and run through it. 01:11:53.370 --> 01:11:56.330 Or if anybody wants to triage PRs or issues as they come in, 01:11:56.510 --> 01:11:59.890 I'd appreciate any of that. And we'll have it linked in the show notes. 01:12:00.010 --> 01:12:00.950 You know it's going to happen. 01:12:01.410 --> 01:12:02.610 Do you need disc donations? 01:12:04.030 --> 01:12:07.730 Maybe, eventually. Well, I bought another pack, so that'll be good for a little while. 01:12:09.250 --> 01:12:12.550 I haven't actually backed anything up yet. I mean, I haven't testing backed 01:12:12.550 --> 01:12:16.350 things up, but, you know. And every time I wanted to use like unique stuff so 01:12:16.350 --> 01:12:18.050 I could test that the database search was working. 01:12:18.210 --> 01:12:22.110 So it's like a lot of me copying files off the NAS to my local system and waiting 01:12:22.110 --> 01:12:26.030 for all that to copy and then waiting for it to burn. Oh, my goodness. 01:12:27.270 --> 01:12:30.110 Software development is ridiculous. I don't know how anybody does this crap. 01:12:30.950 --> 01:12:34.150 I'll tell you what. All right. Well, that's it for us. We'd love to hear from 01:12:34.150 --> 01:12:37.470 you. Of course, you can send us a boost or go to linuxunplugged.com slash contact. 01:12:37.690 --> 01:12:40.950 You could also make it a Tuesday on a Sunday and join us live. 01:12:41.030 --> 01:12:43.430 The mumble room is kicking right now. We have our live chat. 01:12:43.430 --> 01:12:46.750 Of course, we do this on Sundays at 10 a.m. Pacific, 1 p.m. Eastern. 01:12:50.390 --> 01:12:54.930 Wes, you got like a hot power tip for them if they want any extra metadata or 01:12:54.930 --> 01:12:57.750 context around what we talked about things? Do you have any hot tips, Wes? 01:12:57.890 --> 01:13:02.550 Oh, yeah. How about like a magical JSON file that lets you skip around via the 01:13:02.550 --> 01:13:04.590 use of chapters, cloud chapters too, right? 01:13:04.670 --> 01:13:07.710 So it's last decade's hype word built into the chapters. 01:13:07.910 --> 01:13:11.850 What it really means is if we screw up, we can fix it and you get the fix. That's right. 01:13:11.950 --> 01:13:14.790 Yeah, you don't have to download a new MP3. You just get the new fix. 01:13:14.910 --> 01:13:15.710 Which is great for us. 01:13:15.810 --> 01:13:21.010 Yeah. But better than that, we've got transcripts. So you can scrub through the whole thing. 01:13:21.570 --> 01:13:24.290 If you can't hear us and you just want to get a sense of what we said in the 01:13:24.290 --> 01:13:26.630 episode, you want to index it, you want to search it. 01:13:26.670 --> 01:13:29.630 You know what we've never made a call out for? And if anybody's looking for 01:13:29.630 --> 01:13:34.570 a 2026 software project, it'd be really neat to make those searchable. 01:13:34.730 --> 01:13:38.390 Have a front end that sits on top of them. Every transcript is linked in the 01:13:38.390 --> 01:13:41.810 RSS feed sitting out at an endpoint that you could pull in. 01:13:41.890 --> 01:13:45.050 And if anybody wants to make a searchable database out of that so people can 01:13:45.050 --> 01:13:47.290 find keywords what we talked about, that'd be a really helpful tool. 01:13:47.350 --> 01:13:48.410 We'd really appreciate that. 01:13:49.130 --> 01:13:53.050 Links to everything we talked about today. Yep, those are on our website. You know that. 01:13:53.650 --> 01:13:58.470 LinuxUnplugged.com slash 649er. That'll get you the links for what we talked about today. 01:13:58.730 --> 01:14:01.610 Lots of great episodes over there. In fact, you might even say an entire back 01:14:01.610 --> 01:14:07.470 catalog of a whole 648 episodes, if you can believe it. I couldn't believe it. 01:14:07.770 --> 01:14:11.450 Lots of great shows over at, well, at least a few good shows over at jupiterbroadcasting.com. 01:14:11.810 --> 01:14:14.790 We always appreciate if you check those out, too. Thanks so much for joining 01:14:14.790 --> 01:14:18.990 us on this week's episode of Your Unplugged Program. And you're going to see 01:14:18.990 --> 01:14:20.910 us right back here next week.